cotter pins vs rings
 

This is more of an encyclopedic rigging question, but perhaps someone
here could enlighten me:
is there a reason to choose a cotter pin over a cotter ring in any
application, or vice versa?

The kinds of applications I'm thinking are for locking turnbuckles and
clevis pins.

I know my boat has primarily cotter pins, but occasionally there's a
ring, and there seems to be no rhyme or reason to which goes where. It
seems that rings would be much less likely to snag on sails, and they
can also be removed faster and without needing a plier of some sort. So
are cotter pins typically stronger, or is it just habit that makes most
people use them?

Thanks!
Teri
S/V Shadow Line

slampoud wrote:
This is more of an encyclopedic rigging question, but perhaps someone
here could enlighten me:
is there a reason to choose a cotter pin over a cotter ring in any
application, or vice versa?

The kinds of applications I'm thinking are for locking turnbuckles and
clevis pins.

snip

I'm convinced the most misunderstood device on the planet it the lowly
cotter pin.

Cotter pins should only be about 1/4" longer than the dia of the rod,
bolt, etc, the go thru and should then only be spread at the tips about
10 degrees.

Sailing in the Great lakes region meant a 6 month season which meant a
common garden variety duct tape could survive that long.

Year around sailing areas probably need sailing tape.

Would make a little pad from duct tape, place it against the cotter pin
points, then wrap more duct tape around say a turnbuckle body to hold it
secure.

At layup time, simply cut the tape away.

I found rings to be a total waste of time.

YMMV

Lew

On Tue, 21 Jun 2005 01:31:01 GMT, Lew Hodgett
wrote:

Would make a little pad from duct tape, place it against the cotter pin
points, then wrap more duct tape around say a turnbuckle body to hold it
secure.

At layup time, simply cut the tape away.

Good advice, but I do the same with cotter rings. I use the pins on
the spreaders, the boom and places I am unlikely to walk past with
loose clothing.

I found rings to be a total waste of time.

YMMV

I use SS cotter rings on the turnbuckles because they are reusable and
easily inspected. I can also get them on and off with no tools save a
reasonably healthy thumbnail, and can delegate the job. I think each
securing method has its own place, and am not particularly dogmatic
about it. Your advice about keeping them shorter and just bending them
outwards slightly (I've seen super-long ones with their ends twirled
into "mustaches") is correct.

R.

Lew,

Your plan is good if you don't tune the rig much. I can spin out a ring
and change the tension in a stay with my rigging knife.

If you have a boat rigged with rings, you don't need the tape because
there is no thing to snag.

You are largely accurate that a standard cotter pin will stay in with
very little spread of the legs, but that way they can also be knocked
out without much notice. If you do that, tape in not an option.

As to why Slampoud has an in determinite mix, I have no guess. I have a
mix, rings where it take the rig apart and pins (wraped aircraft style)
where I don't.

Matt Colie

Lew Hodgett wrote:
slampoud wrote:

This is more of an encyclopedic rigging question, but perhaps someone
here could enlighten me:
is there a reason to choose a cotter pin over a cotter ring in any
application, or vice versa?

The kinds of applications I'm thinking are for locking turnbuckles and
clevis pins.


snip

I'm convinced the most misunderstood device on the planet it the lowly
cotter pin.

Cotter pins should only be about 1/4" longer than the dia of the rod,
bolt, etc, the go thru and should then only be spread at the tips about
10 degrees.

Sailing in the Great lakes region meant a 6 month season which meant a
common garden variety duct tape could survive that long.

Year around sailing areas probably need sailing tape.

Would make a little pad from duct tape, place it against the cotter pin
points, then wrap more duct tape around say a turnbuckle body to hold it
secure.

At layup time, simply cut the tape away.

I found rings to be a total waste of time.

YMMV

Lew

I used to race a Shark and we used rings on the turnbuckle to chain
plate connection for the shrouds. Unless we taped them, the jib sheets
would regulary unwind them and pull them out.

Dale Gloer

Matt Colie wrote:
Lew,

snip ...

If you have a boat rigged with rings, you don't need the tape because
there is no thing to snag.


snip...

Lew Hodgett wrote:
I found rings to be a total waste of time.

YMMV


OK, my mileage does vary. ;)

rhys wrote:
I use SS cotter rings on the turnbuckles because they are reusable and
easily inspected. I can also get them on and off with no tools save a
reasonably healthy thumbnail, and can delegate the job.

True, the 'reusable' and the 'no tools' parts are the key. As for
delegating, some people (such as my wife) simply cannot learn to cope
with cotter rings.

The former owner of our current boat took a file and sharpened the ends
of the cotter rings on our turnbuckles... I wonder what he thought this
accomplished?


... I think each
securing method has its own place, and am not particularly dogmatic
about it. Your advice about keeping them shorter and just bending them
outwards slightly (I've seen super-long ones with their ends twirled
into "mustaches") is correct.


Agreed. I like to use cotter pins on some types of machinery that rarely
gets taken apart.

DSK

Dale Gloer wrote:
I used to race a Shark and we used rings on the turnbuckle to chain
plate connection for the shrouds. Unless we taped them, the jib sheets
would regulary unwind them and pull them out.

Dale Gloer

Matt Colie wrote:

Lew,

snip ...


If you have a boat rigged with rings, you don't need the tape because
there is no thing to snag.


snip...


During a delivery from Hawaii a few years ago I found 2 of the three cotter
rings at the backstay splitter plate had very nearly fully undone themselves.

After this happened 4 days in a row, and one disappeared from a shroud
turnbuckle, I replaced all rings with pins...

After that I've banned rings on any boat I've had anything to do with.

Brian C

Brian Cleverly wrote:

snip

During a delivery from Hawaii a few years ago I found 2 of the three
cotter rings at the backstay splitter plate had very nearly fully undone
themselves.

After this happened 4 days in a row, and one disappeared from a shroud
turnbuckle, I replaced all rings with pins...

After that I've banned rings on any boat I've had anything to do with.

Heard this same story, more than once.

Have yet to hear of a taped pin coming out.

Lew

I tape cotter rings cuz of this.

The latest Cruising World had an article about this. The point out
that taping stainless steel can lead to corrosion failures. Cotter
pins are the way to go, it seems.
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