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Andrew,
Having done this before, You can use "C" channel for molds You will need at least 2 to make the process viable. You must be prepared to use a steel pot large enough to melt all 70 lbs at the same time because of the grease. The molds should have the dimensions of 4" x 2" x 1". That will give you approximately a 10# weight. You will need to machine both ends of the 4" long, 2" x 1" C" channel square. You can then close up the ends with flat plates at least .250" thick. These should be held together with "C" clamps. You should use a suitable gas burner to melt the lead. I use one from a tar pot used for roofing. You can use a simple soup ladel to fill the mold flush to the top. I suggest using a leveled aluminum plate to set the molds on. This will aid in cooling the mold. Five minutes of cooling should cause the lead to solidify. Cool the mold in water befor reuse. This reduces cycle time. Steve "Andrew Butchart" wrote in message ... I've come into possession of a quantity of lead wheel weights - about 70lbs worth. I'd like to turn them into 10lb weights with an eyebolt on the top. One minor issue is that the weights were stored in an old grease pail and so are quite greasy. As I see it I have three options: - Melt it down and pour it into forms. The good thing with this, is that the weights will be all lead. The bad thing is that I don't know how to make forms - would wood be good enough, or old juice cans? Could I melt the lead on my BBQ - kitchen stove is out because of fumes of course. What about the grease? Should I clean it off first? I'm not keen on this method because of all of the safety issues, but it give me the "best" and most dense result. - Use polyester resin and 1 litre cardboard milk cartons as a form to cast a weight. Would it hold together? Do I need to remove the grease from the wheel weights? - Put the weights into a large juice can and somehow seal up the top. I'd worry about how solid this would be though. Thanks -- Andrew Butchart |
On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 19:29:03 GMT, "Andrew Butchart"
wrote: I've come into possession of a quantity of lead wheel weights - about 70lbs worth. I'd like to turn them into 10lb weights with an eyebolt on the top. One minor issue is that the weights were stored in an old grease pail and so are quite greasy. As I see it I have three options: - Melt it down and pour it into forms. The good thing with this, is that the weights will be all lead. The bad thing is that I don't know how to make forms - would wood be good enough, or old juice cans? Could I melt the lead on my BBQ - kitchen stove is out because of fumes of course. What about the grease? Should I clean it off first? I'm not keen on this method because of all of the safety issues, but it give me the "best" and most dense result. - Use polyester resin and 1 litre cardboard milk cartons as a form to cast a weight. Would it hold together? Do I need to remove the grease from the wheel weights? - Put the weights into a large juice can and somehow seal up the top. I'd worry about how solid this would be though. Thanks Lead melts around 328 degC Paper and card char well below this. Wood is in the same class, though the thicker, the more resistant. I have used a brick form on concrete - the concrete tends to spall explosive shards. Dry brick with fireclay seams could work for you. Greasy lead will smoke badly, better wash it first? A soak in water with Dawn detergent etc. Steel cans would hold up to casting temps. They would probably be best? Brian W |
Andrew Butchart wrote:
I've come into possession of a quantity of lead wheel weights - about 70lbs worth. I'd like to turn them into 10lb weights with an eyebolt on the top. One minor issue is that the weights were stored in an old grease pail and so are quite greasy. snip Don't want to break your bubble, but for 70 lbs, it simply is not worth the work and set up cost. No, your BBQ won't work. You need a melting pot, a large burner, (I used 2, 500,000 BTU propane burners), a dipping ladle and metal molds. (You need to keep lead above about 700F, just to be able to work with it.) Even a good scavanger will have about $100 USD invested before getting started. The above based on collecting and melting enough lead to pour a 20,000 lb ballast. HTH Lew |
Andrew,
Another point to keep in mind is density. The difference between cast lead at around 11+ tons per Cubic Meter and lead shot at 7 tons should persuade you not to use resin and other methods for weights as other materials become more viable at the lower densities. Steve "Andrew Butchart" wrote in message ... I've come into possession of a quantity of lead wheel weights - about 70lbs worth. I'd like to turn them into 10lb weights with an eyebolt on the top. One minor issue is that the weights were stored in an old grease pail and so are quite greasy. As I see it I have three options: - Melt it down and pour it into forms. The good thing with this, is that the weights will be all lead. The bad thing is that I don't know how to make forms - would wood be good enough, or old juice cans? Could I melt the lead on my BBQ - kitchen stove is out because of fumes of course. What about the grease? Should I clean it off first? I'm not keen on this method because of all of the safety issues, but it give me the "best" and most dense result. - Use polyester resin and 1 litre cardboard milk cartons as a form to cast a weight. Would it hold together? Do I need to remove the grease from the wheel weights? - Put the weights into a large juice can and somehow seal up the top. I'd worry about how solid this would be though. Thanks -- Andrew Butchart |
Andrew Butchart writes:
I'd like to turn them into 10lb weights with an eyebolt on the top. I've done this and it works great as follows. You can do 100 lbs of casting in an hour or two. [First, don't worry about (a little) grease and/or rubber, assuming you can work outdoors away from the neighbors. You'll need a Coleman stove, or gas grill with a side burner, or a turkey fryer. Same applies to the steel clips or steel weights mixed in. It will all sort itself out as slag floating in the melt.] Make your melting pot from a cheap stainless steel bowl from Wal-Mart, something larger than the volume of the largest object you want to cast. Use pliers to form a small pouring spout on the lip. Use two locking pliers (Vise Grips) to be handles on opposite sides of the lip. Make molds from aluminum foil bedded in (unused) kitty litter in coffee cans. Form the foil around a model of your desired shape--perhaps an object already at hand, or an item you want to copy, something you carve from foam or wood, or cylinders or blocks. The model shape obviously has to slip easily out of the foil (has "draft"). I used 1/2 inch dowels to cast lead rods, which I then cut into pellets for scuba soft weight belts. You can cast in steel eyes or other fittings in the bottom (forming the foil tightly, securing with a metal twistie) or top (dangle from steel wire from a coat hanger). Take every precaution that a spill won't hit you or anything wet, including your feet. Vapor pressure of molten lead is very low, so while you should avoid the vapors from the melt (do it outdoors), don't be paranoid. Then lemme know how it turns out. |
You don't say what the intended use is, but the eyebolt reminds me of
something I did years ago. I needed a counterweight for a trapdoor, and had the lead - although it was not greasy it was roof flashings and probably worse to melt than wheel weights. I got some metal tins - "jam tins" about 700 grams capacity for jam, roughly the size to give 10 lbs of lead. Melted the lead in another pot - I fancy it was an old cast aluminium saucepan. Ladled the lead it into the jam tin as it was melted. From memory I drilled a hole in the bottom of the tin and put the eye bolt through it with appropriate nuts and washers. In that application it did not matter if the lead wasn't all liquid at once, and the tin remained as a permanent container. End result ( after painting, the heat made the jam tin look pretty sick ...) was a cylindrical weight with an eye bolt... permanently encased in a jam tin. I had a gas ring large enough to melt about a pound of lead, so my investment in the project was virtually nil. I'll mention one safety issue - the biggest one as far as I'm concerned. If there is ANY water in the lead or the form, you can splatter molten lead everywhere. And you have to dispose of the dross. Weights with eye-bolts don't sound very boat like, and if you can live with the slightly larger size for the required weight, I'd consider selling the lead as scrap and buying something else of an appropriate size. The juice can looks another good option, wash the weights to remove most of the oil, allow to dry, dip them in ( catalysed) resin, and drop them in the cans. Don't bother to fill the voids, it adds little mass, adds costs, and gets you into the heat generation issues of large volumes of resin. You could use other stuff to lock the weights together ( old paint ? ) But if you go down this path, don't ever think of using the weights for anything else ... David "Andrew Butchart" wrote in message ... I've come into possession of a quantity of lead wheel weights - about 70lbs worth. I'd like to turn them into 10lb weights with an eyebolt on the top. One minor issue is that the weights were stored in an old grease pail and so are quite greasy. As I see it I have three options: - Melt it down and pour it into forms. The good thing with this, is that the weights will be all lead. The bad thing is that I don't know how to make forms - would wood be good enough, or old juice cans? Could I melt the lead on my BBQ - kitchen stove is out because of fumes of course. What about the grease? Should I clean it off first? I'm not keen on this method because of all of the safety issues, but it give me the "best" and most dense result. - Use polyester resin and 1 litre cardboard milk cartons as a form to cast a weight. Would it hold together? Do I need to remove the grease from the wheel weights? - Put the weights into a large juice can and somehow seal up the top. I'd worry about how solid this would be though. Thanks -- Andrew Butchart |
The definitive read on lead weight casting, written by Glenn Ashmore, a
frequenter of this NG, can be found at: http://www.rutuonline.com/html/the_keel.html enjoy, Jonathan Andrew Butchart wrote: I've come into possession of a quantity of lead wheel weights - about 70lbs worth. I'd like to turn them into 10lb weights with an eyebolt on the top. One minor issue is that the weights were stored in an old grease pail and so are quite greasy. As I see it I have three options: - Melt it down and pour it into forms. The good thing with this, is that the weights will be all lead. The bad thing is that I don't know how to make forms - would wood be good enough, or old juice cans? Could I melt the lead on my BBQ - kitchen stove is out because of fumes of course. What about the grease? Should I clean it off first? I'm not keen on this method because of all of the safety issues, but it give me the "best" and most dense result. - Use polyester resin and 1 litre cardboard milk cartons as a form to cast a weight. Would it hold together? Do I need to remove the grease from the wheel weights? - Put the weights into a large juice can and somehow seal up the top. I'd worry about how solid this would be though. Thanks |
Don't discard the idea of wood molds just because they char. Carbon
crucibles are common and wood sheathing is used in skyscrapers; e.g. the Tribune Tower in Chicago to protect the steel from fire. You aren't going to use the mold all that many times. At the bottom of http://derbyrm.mystarband.net/Dayawl.html is my weighting of the CB for my Chebacco. Since I goofed repeatedly, I got to see the wood before and after pouring -- no significant change except for color. A cast iron pot or skillet might be better than an aluminum one. I've slagged down an aluminum pot on an electric hot plate. Harbor Freight sells some cheap ones from China. I thought the whole process was kind of fun, but I was glad I was wearing boots. Roger http://derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm "Brian Whatcott" wrote in message On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 19:29:03 GMT, "Andrew Butchart" wrote: I've come into possession of a quantity of lead wheel weights - about 70lbs worth. I'd like to turn them into 10lb weights with an eyebolt on the top. One minor issue is that the weights were stored in an old grease pail and so are quite greasy. As I see it I have three options: - Melt it down and pour it into forms. The good thing with this, is that the weights will be all lead. The bad thing is that I don't know how to make forms - would wood be good enough, or old juice cans? Could I melt the lead on my BBQ - kitchen stove is out because of fumes of course. What about the grease? Should I clean it off first? I'm not keen on this method because of all of the safety issues, but it give me the "best" and most dense result. - Use polyester resin and 1 litre cardboard milk cartons as a form to cast a weight. Would it hold together? Do I need to remove the grease from the wheel weights? - Put the weights into a large juice can and somehow seal up the top. I'd worry about how solid this would be though. Thanks Lead melts around 328 degC Paper and card char well below this. Wood is in the same class, though the thicker, the more resistant. I have used a brick form on concrete - the concrete tends to spall explosive shards. Dry brick with fireclay seams could work for you. Greasy lead will smoke badly, better wash it first? A soak in water with Dawn detergent etc. Steel cans would hold up to casting temps. They would probably be best? Brian W |
Thank you everyone for your comments - the purpose of the eyebolt was so
that I can optionally use one of the weights as a lunch anchor on the sailing pirogue as well as allowing me to tie the weights down when using them as ballast. I need the ballast to compensate for the weight of my son at the bow when solo sailing. Having them tied onto the boat also allows me to cut them free in case of emergency rather then building them into the boat. I was going with about 10lb weights as that is a size I should easily be able to manage. I might try melting the lead as several people suggest - doing it outdoors but I suspect that using resin to cast the weights into a can might be my final result. I have to wait for warmer weather no matter what anyway. -- Andrew Butchart |
Andrew,
You seem to have enough lead, but if you need a larger quantity I know of a source of which most people are unaware. It is the nuclear medicine department of your local hospital, usually a part of the x-ray department. They get their radioactive medicine in lead "pigs" that are cylinders about 4 inches in diameter and six inches high with a rather small cavity in the middle. After they receive the medicine they have to store the lead for a period of time (about 6 months as I recall) and then they can dispose of them. Often nuclear medicine techs have been known to sell the lead to recyclers for a little supplement to their salaries. If you offer to take a friendly tech sailing, you might be able to get some big chunks of lead for free or a very cheap price. Lee Huddleston |
"Roger Derby" wrote in message nk.net... Don't discard the idea of wood molds just because they char. Carbon crucibles are common Wood molds can be used when pouring lead. To protect them from charring, paint them with "waterglass". Don't ask me where to get "waterglass"-- someone gave me some when I was using a wood mold for a 3000# ballast keel. It is very fluid and when it dries the surface will have a glossy appearance... Regarding, using the BBQ grill for melting the lead, be careful not to load your pot with too much lead. The legs or grill grate could collapse and spill hot lead on you. Steve s/v Good Intentions |
Wood molds can be used when pouring lead. To protect them from charring, paint them with "waterglass". Don't ask me where to get "waterglass"-- someone gave me some when I was using a wood mold for a 3000# ballast keel. It is very fluid and when it dries the surface will have a glossy appearance... Water glass is carried at most Walmarts. In the automobile section, with radiator stop leaks. ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
You might consider using bolt cutters to cut the wheel weights into
smaller pieces and bagging them like shot bags. Using lead for ballast where it has to be shifted around can be hard on the insides of a small boat and the shot bags are a lot more friendly. For a lunch hook, you can use a one pound coffee can about half full for ten pounds. I've done it in a BBQ and it works just fine. The only part that didn't turn out okay was that my eyebolt rusted badly after using it in salt water. The waterglass (Sodium silicate, sold in some drug stores) works great as a mold release and to seal a mold from leakage. Al Gunther Kingston, WA ---- 47=B0 48.1'N, 122=B0 30.0'W |
I have 4500lb +/- of keel lead for sale.
This is the ballast from a Pearson Vanguard. I've not weighed it but the vessel specs say 4500lb ballast. The lead is in 2 castings and is clean due to being encapsulated. Pix at: http://www.anzam.com/images/pearson_keel You'd have to pick up at Sacramento.. Any interest ? Brian C wrote: You might consider using bolt cutters to cut the wheel weights into smaller pieces and bagging them like shot bags. Using lead for ballast where it has to be shifted around can be hard on the insides of a small boat and the shot bags are a lot more friendly. For a lunch hook, you can use a one pound coffee can about half full for ten pounds. I've done it in a BBQ and it works just fine. The only part that didn't turn out okay was that my eyebolt rusted badly after using it in salt water. The waterglass (Sodium silicate, sold in some drug stores) works great as a mold release and to seal a mold from leakage. Al Gunther Kingston, WA ---- 47° 48.1'N, 122° 30.0'W |
It's good for dipping your eggs in to preserve them a long time. Waterglass,
not lead! -- Keith __ All those who believe in psycho-kinesis, raise my hand. wrote in message ups.com... The waterglass (Sodium silicate, sold in some drug stores) works great as a mold release and to seal a mold from leakage. |
Yea, it's great use for the stuff, but hardly one which will keep me in
employment ... I makethe stuff DF "Keith" wrote in message ... It's good for dipping your eggs in to preserve them a long time. Waterglass, not lead! -- Keith __ All those who believe in psycho-kinesis, raise my hand. wrote in message ups.com... The waterglass (Sodium silicate, sold in some drug stores) works great as a mold release and to seal a mold from leakage. |
Not a problem... when I worked for Akzo, we used plenty to make catalysts.
As long as there's oil, you'll have all the market you can handle! -- Keith __ We put the "K" in "Kwality. "David Flew" wrote in message ... Yea, it's great use for the stuff, but hardly one which will keep me in employment ... I makethe stuff DF "Keith" wrote in message ... It's good for dipping your eggs in to preserve them a long time. Waterglass, not lead! -- Keith __ All those who believe in psycho-kinesis, raise my hand. wrote in message ups.com... The waterglass (Sodium silicate, sold in some drug stores) works great as a mold release and to seal a mold from leakage. |
What did you do with the rest of the boat?
Jonathan Brian Cleverly wrote: I have 4500lb +/- of keel lead for sale. This is the ballast from a Pearson Vanguard. I've not weighed it but the vessel specs say 4500lb ballast. The lead is in 2 castings and is clean due to being encapsulated. Pix at: http://www.anzam.com/images/pearson_keel You'd have to pick up at Sacramento.. Any interest ? Brian C wrote: You might consider using bolt cutters to cut the wheel weights into smaller pieces and bagging them like shot bags. Using lead for ballast where it has to be shifted around can be hard on the insides of a small boat and the shot bags are a lot more friendly. For a lunch hook, you can use a one pound coffee can about half full for ten pounds. I've done it in a BBQ and it works just fine. The only part that didn't turn out okay was that my eyebolt rusted badly after using it in salt water. The waterglass (Sodium silicate, sold in some drug stores) works great as a mold release and to seal a mold from leakage. Al Gunther Kingston, WA ---- 47° 48.1'N, 122° 30.0'W |
Jonathan wrote:
What did you do with the rest of the boat? Jonathan Cut it into 4ft x 4ft pieces and deposited in landfill. If you are interested further, the repair history is documented at: http://tinyurl.com/6bgyp Brian C Brian Cleverly wrote: I have 4500lb +/- of keel lead for sale. This is the ballast from a Pearson Vanguard. I've not weighed it but the vessel specs say 4500lb ballast. The lead is in 2 castings and is clean due to being encapsulated. Pix at: http://www.anzam.com/images/pearson_keel You'd have to pick up at Sacramento.. Any interest ? Brian C wrote: You might consider using bolt cutters to cut the wheel weights into smaller pieces and bagging them like shot bags. Using lead for ballast where it has to be shifted around can be hard on the insides of a small boat and the shot bags are a lot more friendly. For a lunch hook, you can use a one pound coffee can about half full for ten pounds. I've done it in a BBQ and it works just fine. The only part that didn't turn out okay was that my eyebolt rusted badly after using it in salt water. The waterglass (Sodium silicate, sold in some drug stores) works great as a mold release and to seal a mold from leakage. Al Gunther Kingston, WA ---- 47° 48.1'N, 122° 30.0'W |
If you wash it to get rid of the grease, for god's sake (and yours) make
sure you get it absolutely dry before you put it into molten lead. You DON'T want to be around when it starts spitting... Pirate_Dave -- In article , Brian Whatcott wrote: On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 19:29:03 GMT, "Andrew Butchart" wrote: I've come into possession of a quantity of lead wheel weights - about 70lbs worth. I'd like to turn them into 10lb weights with an eyebolt on the top. One minor issue is that the weights were stored in an old grease pail and so are quite greasy. As I see it I have three options: - Melt it down and pour it into forms. The good thing with this, is that the weights will be all lead. The bad thing is that I don't know how to make forms - would wood be good enough, or old juice cans? Could I melt the lead on my BBQ - kitchen stove is out because of fumes of course. What about the grease? Should I clean it off first? I'm not keen on this method because of all of the safety issues, but it give me the "best" and most dense result. - Use polyester resin and 1 litre cardboard milk cartons as a form to cast a weight. Would it hold together? Do I need to remove the grease from the wheel weights? - Put the weights into a large juice can and somehow seal up the top. I'd worry about how solid this would be though. Thanks Lead melts around 328 degC Paper and card char well below this. Wood is in the same class, though the thicker, the more resistant. I have used a brick form on concrete - the concrete tends to spall explosive shards. Dry brick with fireclay seams could work for you. Greasy lead will smoke badly, better wash it first? A soak in water with Dawn detergent etc. Steel cans would hold up to casting temps. They would probably be best? Brian W |
After quite a bit of thought, I ended up using a pretty low-tech
solution that worked well for me. YMMV I picked up 4 small metal cake pans for 50 cents each - the ones with the removable bottoms and dumped the wheel weights in there. With both the front and back doors of the garage open to provide ventilation, I used my soldering torch pointing into the pan to melt the weights and picked out the clips with a pair of long pliers. The advantages of this was that it wasn't complicated and did not require handling molten lead. The amount of heat involved wasn't difficult to come by as I was really only melting the top layer. I was also able to tear off the pans fairly easily to end up with my finished weights (the pans were cheap). I suspended an eyebolt in the pan at the beginning with a nut and washer on it so I have a way to tie the weights down and transport them. It only took moments for the completed weights to solidify. The disadvantages were that it did take a fair amount of time to do and the resulting units still contain a fair number of clips and half-melted weights so they're kinda ugly and dirty. Each weight comes in at about 15lbs and I ended up with 4 which is pretty much exactly the weight I wanted. |
Why not use beer cans? Cut the top off, punch a hole in the bottom
through which you put your threaded bolt with a nut and washer (to really hold it in the lead). Put the cans eye-bolt side down into a pail of sand and pour. Later peel off the aluminum can and Voila. My company used to be in a building with several other "shady" techie entrepreneurs. One of them told me he was going to be working on a "MRI" project so there would be delivery of a huge surplus MRI machine. When it was delivered, the workers started bringing in large (10"X10"X2"" very heavy pieces that were painted. Some had holes that obviously aligned. I noticed the weight and asked what they were and a worker told me they were "magnets for the MRI, thats why they are so heavy". I walked over and scratched one with my key and said "magnets hell, thats lead and thats a gamma ray machine you have there and unless you have 10X that amount of lead you can stop delivery." The other guy told me he thought I would be upset by an unlicensed gamma ray source so he thought he would call it an MRI. Later, he did obtain a LOT of lead bricks from some nuclear lab, it was a couple tons and he had it loaded into the bed of his large truck which he parked on a slight incline. Well, it was an old truck and he had never bothered to see if its emergency brake would hold so the next day the truck was found halfway through the wall of our building where it had rolled. Even more impressive was the sight of so many lead bricks that had spilled through the cab and collapsed the driver seat. |
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