35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

here is a picture of the sail on my boat, it's a few inches shy of the
stripe 6.5 inches to be exact, but with a bigger roach, it will be
plenty of sail area. plus when you jibe in light air, you want to
clear the backstay. BTW, the OEM mylar mains were a few inches short of
the hoist mark on these boats and I've never seen a 35s5 in person or
online with the head level with the stripe, so we worked with that and
generated more roach than the stock main for greater square footage
overall. We copied the setup from a North sail that was cut the same
way. Try sailing under the main by itself and you'll really see what
this sail can do. Remember the max hoist is set for the mast and not a
"goal" for where the hoist must reach. Added roach is superior to max.
hoist. Ask any sailmaker. Center of effort is lower and we point
better. I think you'll be very pleased with the sail.

Mike


Mike is the original owner. He sent me the same pic I've been posting
which shows the top batten close to the backstay. You can't hit the
hoist stripe without giving up roach, period. The added roach ADDS sail
area over the convention main, yet Sloco somehow thinks North, Doyle,
UK and others who race all have it wrong!
In any case, this is all silly. We're not racing, so even if the Kevlar
main was flawed by a short hoist and no additional roach, it wouldn't
matter. Of course that's not the case, as Sloco probably now realizes
and he's having a COW!!!!

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!.....I'm off to the boats, folk. Nice looking day. Wish I
had the genoa here to really try things out....it'll have to wait until
next week. Boo hoo!



RB
35s5
NY

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

So it's all about not letting the roach hit the backstay is it.
Hogwash! My new main reaches full hoist and has max roach. Yes it
hits the backstay when tacking.............so what. In fact it gets
hung up in light air. We just flick the backstay. Face it you were
sold a screwed up main that the original owner wasn't satisfied with.
You got what you paid for.

35s5 owners: cheap.

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

"Ringmaster" wrote in message
In fact it gets
hung up in light air. We just flick the backstay.

Oh Yeah... there's a glaring endorsement.... you're rigged to foul in light
air!?

CM-

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

"Ringmaster" wrote
In fact it gets
hung up in light air. We just flick the backstay.


Capt.Mooron wrote:
Oh Yeah... there's a glaring endorsement.... you're rigged to foul in light
air!?


No problem. Some boats have so much roach, the main overlaps
the backstay by a foot or more.

Many full-batten boats have to give the boom a quick pump to
get the sail re-cambered to the new side when they tack.
Again, not really a problem.

Both can be a little annoying, but it's the price to pay to
have a boat that performs well. It's a lot smarter than
having the sail a foot short of the black bands and claiming
that one is gaining sail area.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

"DSK" wrote in message
"Ringmaster" wrote
In fact it gets
hung up in light air. We just flick the backstay.


Capt.Mooron wrote:
Oh Yeah... there's a glaring endorsement.... you're rigged to foul in
light air!?


No problem. Some boats have so much roach, the main overlaps the backstay
by a foot or more.

Yeah... Well, there ya go. I sail a full keeler. full batten, loose footed
with 3 reef points... It's reef the main, reef the main power from the
headsail.


Many full-batten boats have to give the boom a quick pump to get the sail
re-cambered to the new side when they tack. Again, not really a problem.

I've never had to do that and certainly wouldn't rig for it to occur in
light airs... where clean travel and quick tacks are required. Then again I
don't have backstay clearence issues to deal with. It's a fin keeler thing.

Both can be a little annoying, but it's the price to pay to have a boat
that performs well. It's a lot smarter than having the sail a foot short
of the black bands and claiming that one is gaining sail area.

See there you guys go again with these marks.... like who cares? I think
it's a fair assumption to make that nobody on this group considers Bobsprit
a proficient sailor. He's marginal at best... totally ignorant of anything
but the very basics of navigation, He hardly ever deploys the headsail and
has never flown his chute.

Bottom Line is.... he'll have really cool looking sails. He'll even look
cool sailing. His boat is so plain as to warrant some fancy items. This in
no way means he'll be able to fully realize the potential or impediments.

It's his Lada.... if he wants a gold plated grill... who am I to argue?

CM-

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

Bottom Line is.... he'll have really cool looking sails. He'll
even look
cool sailing.

Cool looking to whom? Another non sailor? Most knowledgable boat
owners would think that main looks stupid a foot short of the black
band. Maybe the Boobster could grind it up to the mark in 2nd gear
until the luff is about to explode.

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

No problem. Some boats have so much roach, the main overlaps the backstay
by a foot or more.


Capt.Mooron wrote:
Yeah... Well, there ya go. I sail a full keeler. full batten, loose footed
with 3 reef points... It's reef the main, reef the main power from the
headsail.


I thought your boat was a mast head rigged cutter. Anyway
plenty of boats have the same characteristics, power from
the headsail.


Many full-batten boats have to give the boom a quick pump to get the sail
re-cambered to the new side when they tack. Again, not really a problem.


I've never had to do that and certainly wouldn't rig for it to occur in
light airs... where clean travel and quick tacks are required.

It doesn't really slow you donw tacking, you just have to
remember to do it. In fact it gives you more speed coming
out of the tack and forcing camber into the sail makes it
more powerful.

Personally I don't really like it either. The newer rig with
a few full battens up at the top, then some small
conventional battens along the lower leach, seem to work
pretty well and rarely have to be popped.



Then again I
don't have backstay clearence issues to deal with. It's a fin keeler thing.


heh not any kind of keel. It's a mid-girth of the mainsail
thing. How much sail area do you want? More roach is one way
to get more.



.... I think
it's a fair assumption to make that nobody on this group considers Bobsprit
a proficient sailor. He's marginal at best... totally ignorant of anything
but the very basics of navigation, He hardly ever deploys the headsail and
has never flown his chute.


But he always "wins."


It's his Lada.... if he wants a gold plated grill... who am I to argue?


Moi?
Argue??
Never!

DSK

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

"Ringmaster" wrote in message
oups.com...
Bottom Line is.... he'll have really cool looking sails. He'll
even look
cool sailing.

Cool looking to whom? Another non sailor? Most knowledgable boat
owners would think that main looks stupid a foot short of the black
band. Maybe the Boobster could grind it up to the mark in 2nd gear
until the luff is about to explode.

I almost feel naked.... I have no "Black Marks".

Then again I don't spend a lot of time inspecting details on the various
rigging and sets on other boats... especially fin keelers.

I mean let's face it... most fin keelers are anal retentive, coastal divas
playing on over sized surf boards. When you guys are reviewing the merits of
high tech sails... I can afford to price out a nice set of heavy Tanbarks.
It's a matter of "day sailing" versus "days sailing".

CM-

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

So it's all about not letting the roach hit the backstay is it.
Hogwash!



I don't want to "thump th backstay" to clear the main on tacks and
gybes, nor do I want a sail to get more wear for that idea.
I have a ultra modern Kevlar main with more Sq. ft than the stock main
and it DOES NOT contact the backstay EVER. This seems to be a lot
smarter than what you're endorsing. What's more, when discussing adding
roach BOTH UK and Doyle felt it was best to avoid the sail contacting
the backstay.
Hmmm....seems like two lofts and the loft that made the sail all agree.
So did the original owner and North sails where they adopted to cut
from.
Now...on to making a total ass of Sloco....I have found out that NO max
hoist stripe was added by Beneteau on the 35s5's. And I'm going to post
a pic (again) to prove it. But that's for a better thread than this!


RB
35s5
NY

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

"DSK" wrote in message

I thought your boat was a mast head rigged cutter. Anyway plenty of boats
have the same characteristics, power from the headsail.

masthead sloop...

Many full-batten boats have to give the boom a quick pump to get the sail
re-cambered to the new side when they tack. Again, not really a problem.

I have never been required to do that... then again most novices overtighten
their battens.

It doesn't really slow you donw tacking, you just have to remember to do
it. In fact it gives you more speed coming out of the tack and forcing
camber into the sail makes it more powerful.

I can't understand the value in having to pump the boom to snap a batten to
the opposite camber.... when merely having it happen, smoothly , on it's
own, within a normal sweep of the boom would be any slower.

How much sail area do you want? More roach is one way to get more.

I want a suit of canvas that my vessel will comfortably carry. They needn't
be woven from pixie dust and quantum filaments.

I can carry a 160% deck sweeper of a gen and full main in up to 22 kts of
wind. At 45 + kts I can deploy the storm jib and drop 3 reefs in the main to
make ground to winward with minimal heel and max progress. I have a reefable
120 and a 100.

CM-

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message

Or in your case, daze sailing.

Quit suckin' up ... !!!

CM-

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

I thought your boat was a mast head rigged cutter. Anyway plenty of boats
have the same characteristics, power from the headsail.


Capt.Mooron wrote:
masthead sloop...


I am kind of partial to frac rigs myself, but that's a
personal taste. Masthead rigs are generally stronger.



Many full-batten boats have to give the boom a quick pump to get the sail
re-cambered to the new side when they tack. Again, not really a problem.


I have never been required to do that... then again most novices overtighten
their battens.


Or people who want to force camber into their sails for more
power in light air or waves.



I can't understand the value in having to pump the boom to snap a batten to
the opposite camber.... when merely having it happen, smoothly , on it's
own, within a normal sweep of the boom would be any slower.


If you're racing, it gives you a free pump of the sail ;)



How much sail area do you want? More roach is one way to get more.


I want a suit of canvas that my vessel will comfortably carry. They needn't
be woven from pixie dust and quantum filaments.


How about dinghy made from that ;)


I can carry a 160% deck sweeper of a gen and full main in up to 22 kts of
wind.

Hmm, unless you sail in an area where that's an everyday
occurence, I would call your boat underpowered. Most of the
places I sail, a boat would have to be well powered up in 5
~ 8 knots of wind. That means changing down and/or reefing
as the wind climbs thru the teens.


At 45 + kts I can deploy the storm jib and drop 3 reefs in the main to
make ground to winward with minimal heel and max progress. I have a reefable
120 and a 100.


A reefable jib, especially one with removable panels, is
great but it seems out of favor nowadays. I used to sail on
boats with lace-on foot panels that were great in strong
wind. I also like a main with a triple reef.

Our little Hunter came with only one short reef, when we
ordered custom sails I got 2 with the height of the reef
planned so that the leach of the main would oppose the
headstay and then the spreaders & lowers. We sailed that
boat a couple of times under main alone in 35+ winds. Most
mass-produced boats aren't rigged all that well for reefing
& heavy weather sailing IMHO.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

Now...on to making a total ass of Sloco....I have found out that NO
max
hoist stripe was added by Beneteau on the 35s5's. And I'm going to post

a pic (again) to prove it. But that's for a better thread than
this!

Hey Dude, I was only going by the pictures YOU posted. That mast had a
black band. Or was it 2? Or maybe 3? You never did explain that one.
Maybe one was for PHRF and the other one was for MORC. Or maybe one
was just the mast head crane/extrusion joint like I said. Good luck.

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

"DSK" wrote in message

Hmm, unless you sail in an area where that's an everyday occurence, I
would call your boat underpowered. Most of the places I sail, a boat would
have to be well powered up in 5 ~ 8 knots of wind. That means changing
down and/or reefing as the wind climbs thru the teens.

Ahem... you'd be in a constant state of reef around here if that's what you
are accustomed to. Sounds rather tender and finicky. 20-25 kts wind here is
pretty normal. You don't make much headway when sailing into a seaway in any
wind below 10kts. The swells alone can be 30 feet high. I don't do much
playing with thermals and lifts... wind here just appears from a direction
and you use it to get where you want. It's usually steady but can be gusty.
My boat makes good in sea conditions and provides a dry, solid feel with
sufficient balance to accommodate the wind and wave states.

I have found that I can achieve higher sustained speeds in ocean conditions
than in coastal/harbour areas. Nonetheless... I have a solid sailboat that
has never failed to impress me and has delivered it's various crews to the
destination in comfort, safely and in good time.

One can't ask for more....

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

I have a solid sailboat that
has never failed


Yep, just keep rebuilding it and you'll be fine. What you've basically
done is buy a poor boat and rebuild it into a low end Island Packet.
Good for you.
I have a Mercury Bobcat. Can you take the parts and build me a Lotus?



RB
35s5
NY

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message

Yep, just keep rebuilding it and you'll be fine. What you've basically
done is buy a poor boat and rebuild it into a low end Island Packet.
Good for you.

Look... I maintain and upgrade my boat according to requirements imposed by
time, atrophy and geography..... you simply flog your boat and buy another.
However you decide to intrepret that..... I know every strenght and weakness
of my vessel. You do not have that luxury Bobsprit. You'll never experience
the true merging of man and boat to exceed the sum of it's parts. You
seriously need to expand your horizons. You need to see yourself for what
you are. If not.... you'll never inspire that confidence in your crew and
you'll never, ever understand that achievement.

I have a Mercury Bobcat. Can you take the parts and build me a Lotus?

Short answer... you can "Pimp Your Own Ride" ... you've been doing it for
years! It won't make you a better sailor ... anymore than having a gold
plated grill on a Lada make you a better driver.

Thank You Very Much... I'll be here all week.

CM-

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

.... Most of the places I sail, a boat would
have to be well powered up in 5 ~ 8 knots of wind. That means changing
down and/or reefing as the wind climbs thru the teens.


Capt.Mooron wrote:
Ahem... you'd be in a constant state of reef around here if that's what you
are accustomed to.

Which would be fine.
Another thing is that small racing class boats do not have
reef points. You learn to power up, you learn to de-power.

... Sounds rather tender and finicky.

Only if you think that a number assigned to the wind you
sail in is something to brag about. More=better, right?

I happen to like sailing in strong winds, but also don't
like to be stuck in a boat that won't move when there is
less wind.


.... 20-25 kts wind here is
pretty normal. You don't make much headway when sailing into a seaway in any
wind below 10kts.

You do in a boat that is designed for it.

.... The swells alone can be 30 feet high.

Doesn't mean much if the crests are far apart & not breaking.

.... I don't do much
playing with thermals and lifts... wind here just appears from a direction
and you use it to get where you want. It's usually steady but can be gusty.

The wind shifts direction more than you think. Even a 30
knot wind will clock & veer 5 or even 10 degrees pretty
regularly. If you're sailing a long straight leg, there's no
reason to "use" these shifts but if you're trying to get
around a point or avoid a reef, it helps to follow them
rather than fight (or ignore) them.



My boat makes good in sea conditions and provides a dry, solid feel with
sufficient balance to accommodate the wind and wave states.


Which is all good ;)

I have found that I can achieve higher sustained speeds in ocean conditions
than in coastal/harbour areas.

Sure, that's what it was designed for. It could be raced
around the bouys, in fact it could even be fun against
similar boats. But your Nordica is designed for sea
conditions and although I haven't sailed one, I have seen
them around and think they would be hard to improve on for that.


One can't ask for more....


Sure you could. A boat with a self-cleaning head and a
cooler with a little mechanical hand that pops out with a
drink right by the helm.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

"DSK" wrote in message

Sure you could. A boat with a self-cleaning head

Whoa... up here we refer to that as "crew"

and a
cooler with a little mechanical hand that pops out with a drink right by
the helm.

Up here that's a galley wench.

CM-

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

"Capt.Mooron" wrote:

"DSK" wrote in message

Sure you could. A boat with a self-cleaning head

Whoa... up here we refer to that as "crew"

Well, when I come up there for a 2 day sail, I hope you refer to me as
company, not crew!

LP (bringing the old "cedar bucket" with me...)

and a
cooler with a little mechanical hand that pops out with a drink right by
the helm.

Up here that's a galley wench.

CM-

Does that include "furry handcuffs"? heh

LP (hoping you can cook better than Capt. Neal)

35s5 and Dopey Sloco!
 

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message

Try hauling up the anchor when sailing.

I would be breaching the local ordinance regarding not exceeding the speed
of light.

CM-