Frustrated
 

I have noted a rise in frustration lately on this group.

I think many people are frustrated and showing that frustration by
being grouchy, mean and crass. Take Katysails, for example. She has
become the witch we all knew she was. She could no longer keep up
the facade of being somewhat normal.

Mooron is clearly angry and upset at being shut in and not able to
sail his sturdy but slow vessel. Gaynz is probably afraid to sail his
tiny craft with all the rain and storms California is having.

Ole Thom seems to be somewhat out of sorts in that the conditions
in his neck of the woods is not conducive to sailing either.

Please note how the above people who claim to be sailors have got
themselves stuck in places where sailing is but a dream most of the
year. One must wonder why they remain living in regions where they
know they will be frustrated most of the year?

Is it because they are stupid? Lazy? Unmotivated? Trapped? Awaiting
trial? Perhaps, but I think the real reason boils down to the fact that
they are, in their hearts, lubbers. If they were really sailors they
would have found a way to live in places that allow them to sail on
a year round basis.

The only conclusion I can draw is Joe and I are the only real sailors
on this newsgroup.

CN

On Sun, 20 Feb 2005 23:49:20 -0500, Capt. Neal®
wrote this crap:

The only conclusion I can draw is Joe and I are the only real sailors
on this newsgroup.


Keep up the fantasies. It's highly entertaining to read these.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message

I have noted a rise in frustration lately on this group.

I think many people are frustrated and showing that frustration by
being grouchy, mean and crass. Take Katysails, for example. She has
become the witch we all knew she was. She could no longer keep up
the facade of being somewhat normal.

Mooron is clearly angry and upset at being shut in and not able to
sail his sturdy but slow vessel. Gaynz is probably afraid to sail his
tiny craft with all the rain and storms California is having.

Ole Thom seems to be somewhat out of sorts in that the conditions
in his neck of the woods is not conducive to sailing either.

Please note how the above people who claim to be sailors have got
themselves stuck in places where sailing is but a dream most of the
year. One must wonder why they remain living in regions where they
know they will be frustrated most of the year?

Is it because they are stupid? Lazy? Unmotivated? Trapped? Awaiting
trial? Perhaps, but I think the real reason boils down to the fact that
they are, in their hearts, lubbers. If they were really sailors they
would have found a way to live in places that allow them to sail on
a year round basis.
The only conclusion I can draw is Joe and I are the only real sailors
on this newsgroup.

Someone might be stupid, lazy, and/or unmotivated, because these trolls of
yours can't even attain the bottom of the rating scale anymore. Is it us,
or you?

Max

No one else has changed, so it must be you. Maybe that prescription needs
filling or maybe a med change is in order?

"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message
...
I have noted a rise in frustration lately on this group.

I think many people are frustrated and showing that frustration by
being grouchy, mean and crass. Take Katysails, for example. She has
become the witch we all knew she was. She could no longer keep up
the facade of being somewhat normal.

Mooron is clearly angry and upset at being shut in and not able to
sail his sturdy but slow vessel. Gaynz is probably afraid to sail his
tiny craft with all the rain and storms California is having.

Ole Thom seems to be somewhat out of sorts in that the conditions
in his neck of the woods is not conducive to sailing either.

Please note how the above people who claim to be sailors have got
themselves stuck in places where sailing is but a dream most of the
year. One must wonder why they remain living in regions where they
know they will be frustrated most of the year?

Is it because they are stupid? Lazy? Unmotivated? Trapped? Awaiting
trial? Perhaps, but I think the real reason boils down to the fact that
they are, in their hearts, lubbers. If they were really sailors they
would have found a way to live in places that allow them to sail on
a year round basis.
The only conclusion I can draw is Joe and I are the only real sailors
on this newsgroup.

CN

Nah, now that I'm gone he will turn into the asshole he's always been...

LP

"katysails" wrote in message
...
No one else has changed, so it must be you. Maybe that prescription needs
filling or maybe a med change is in order?

"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message
...
I have noted a rise in frustration lately on this group.

I think many people are frustrated and showing that frustration by
being grouchy, mean and crass. Take Katysails, for example. She has
become the witch we all knew she was. She could no longer keep up
the facade of being somewhat normal.

Mooron is clearly angry and upset at being shut in and not able to
sail his sturdy but slow vessel. Gaynz is probably afraid to sail his
tiny craft with all the rain and storms California is having.

Ole Thom seems to be somewhat out of sorts in that the conditions
in his neck of the woods is not conducive to sailing either.

Please note how the above people who claim to be sailors have got
themselves stuck in places where sailing is but a dream most of the
year. One must wonder why they remain living in regions where they
know they will be frustrated most of the year?

Is it because they are stupid? Lazy? Unmotivated? Trapped? Awaiting
trial? Perhaps, but I think the real reason boils down to the fact that
they are, in their hearts, lubbers. If they were really sailors they
would have found a way to live in places that allow them to sail on
a year round basis.
The only conclusion I can draw is Joe and I are the only real sailors
on this newsgroup.

CN

Capt. Neal=AE wrote:
I have noted a rise in frustration lately on this group.

I think many people are frustrated and showing that frustration by
being grouchy, mean and crass. Take Katysails, for example. She has
become the witch we all knew she was. She could no longer keep up
the facade of being somewhat normal.

Mooron is clearly angry and upset at being shut in and not able to
sail his sturdy but slow vessel. Gaynz is probably afraid to sail his
tiny craft with all the rain and storms California is having.

Ole Thom seems to be somewhat out of sorts in that the conditions
in his neck of the woods is not conducive to sailing either.

Please note how the above people who claim to be sailors have got
themselves stuck in places where sailing is but a dream most of the
year. One must wonder why they remain living in regions where they
know they will be frustrated most of the year?

Is it because they are stupid? Lazy? Unmotivated? Trapped? Awaiting
trial? Perhaps, but I think the real reason boils down to the fact
that
they are, in their hearts, lubbers. If they were really sailors they
would have found a way to live in places that allow them to sail on
a year round basis.

The only conclusion I can draw is Joe and I are the only real sailors
on this newsgroup.

CN


Indeed to suffer a sailing less 6+ mo a years, and to have to wrap
your boat is down right lubbery. To own a boat that is not capable of
living aboard... and not living aboard... put you in the class of the
weekend warriors. And to not have the seatime or ambition to sit for a
Capt. ticket shows no ambition or savy of the way of the sea.....and
again is lubbery. How they can sleep at night without being rocked to
bed is beyond me. Anyone who spends more time ashore than afloat is
lubbery IMHO.

Joe

This would really mean something if the pair of you weren't moored or docked
for 99% of the time. Let's face it.... your time aboard would be better
spent if you both hauled your vessels and did some maintenance for a change.

My vessel will age far less drastically than either of yours. Cut The
Mustard no doubt has a saturated hull from extended immersion and Red Cloud
is rusting on a wet berth.

Hauling out every season allows me to inspect and maintain my vessel's hull
and submerged components. While I change zincs annually... Joe's 200 zincs
are deteriorating daily. While Capt. Neal's spongy hull is becoming infested
with a marine growth to rival a coral reef.... mine is clear, smooth, hard
and crustacean free. While Cut the Mustard's hull is discolouring...
Overproof's hull is waxed to the waterline and so shiny you can shave in the
reflection. While the pair of you can only entertain wet maintenance.... I
have the luxury of seasonal dry dock overhauls and full access for
maintenance & repairs.

You pay a price for the convenience of warm weather sailing.... grossly
polluted locations, a plethora of other boats to contend with, advanced
deterioration of equipment, corrosion, complacency as well as exaggerated
mooring & docking fees.

I'll stick to my seasonal sailing regime thank-you very much..... the water
here is deep blue, pristine by comparison and I can actually eat the fish or
shellfish without fear of mercury or other toxic contamination! The fact
that I'm fortunate to even spot 2 or 3 vessels out sailing in the summer is
as well a benefit neither of you enjoy!!

CM



"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message
...
I have noted a rise in frustration lately on this group.

I think many people are frustrated and showing that frustration by
being grouchy, mean and crass. Take Katysails, for example. She has
become the witch we all knew she was. She could no longer keep up
the facade of being somewhat normal.

Mooron is clearly angry and upset at being shut in and not able to
sail his sturdy but slow vessel. Gaynz is probably afraid to sail his
tiny craft with all the rain and storms California is having.

Ole Thom seems to be somewhat out of sorts in that the conditions
in his neck of the woods is not conducive to sailing either.

Please note how the above people who claim to be sailors have got
themselves stuck in places where sailing is but a dream most of the
year. One must wonder why they remain living in regions where they
know they will be frustrated most of the year?

Is it because they are stupid? Lazy? Unmotivated? Trapped? Awaiting
trial? Perhaps, but I think the real reason boils down to the fact that
they are, in their hearts, lubbers. If they were really sailors they
would have found a way to live in places that allow them to sail on
a year round basis.
The only conclusion I can draw is Joe and I are the only real sailors
on this newsgroup.

CN

Mooron, I have no need to haul my vessel every year, My zincs are in
almost pristine condition all 7 of them. I only need to haul every 3
yrs or so to put a new coat of antifoulant. The epoxy barrier coat will
last 20 yrs if not damaged while removing old antifoulant. Here we dive
to brush away the scum dont need a wet suit either. Waxin boats is
for wussies. My paint shines like new for 3 years and never need
waxing. Here i can sail for 45 min and be dragging a shrimp net that
will fill with shrimp, flounders, crabs, and the occasional redfish all
most excellent for eating. I can land on a number of oyster reefs and
rake up 2-3 sack within an hour...a perfect cold weather adventure. 10
mile offshore we have crystal clear blue water with excellent reefs for
catching Ling, Red Snapper, Groupers, Tuna, Kings, Dolphins, Shark ect
ect......And my equipment is kept in excellent condition at all times
because it's used all the time. While your dryrotts as your hull hoggs
in a cradle.

Joe

"Joe" wrote in message
oups.com...
Mooron, I have no need to haul my vessel every year,

You do but you just can't bother.

My zincs are in
almost pristine condition all 7 of them.

Then they aren't doing their job.

I only need to haul every 3
yrs or so to put a new coat of antifoulant. The epoxy barrier coat will
last 20 yrs if not damaged while removing old antifoulant. Here we dive
to brush away the scum dont need a wet suit either.

Antifoulant that lasts 3 years in a tropical climate is some toxic sludge
alright! I wouldn't swim in your area ... let alone dive there!


Waxin boats is
for wussies. My paint shines like new for 3 years and never need
waxing.

Painted... Hah.... I have original gelcoat! Paint is for metal and wooden
boats.


Here i can sail for 45 min and be dragging a shrimp net that
will fill with shrimp, flounders, crabs, and the occasional redfish all
most excellent for eating. I can land on a number of oyster reefs and
rake up 2-3 sack within an hour...a perfect cold weather adventure. 10
mile offshore we have crystal clear blue water with excellent reefs for
catching Ling, Red Snapper, Groupers, Tuna, Kings, Dolphins, Shark ect
ect......

Your area is one of the most polluted locations in the USA next to Florida!!
Nova Scotia has way more seafood available year round.... and it's not
tainted by industrial run-off and the pollution of a million vessels whose
hulls are coated with a toxic, ablative coating that lasts 3 years...
constantly dropping paricles onto the scallop and oyster beds!


And my equipment is kept in excellent condition at all times
because it's used all the time.

Used for what... you're at the dock 99% of the time. My equipment is
serviced and overhauled every season!


While your dryrotts as your hull hoggs
in a cradle.

It's a custom cradle... no hogging and no flexing. The pads and keel bed are
all adjustable. Drying a fibreglass hull is not damaging at all... unlike
leaving a rust bucket in salt water all year.

CM

My zincs dont waste away very fast because I have no stray voltage in
my hull. My hull is isolated from all electrical currents bith AC & DC.
I also use a isolater to keep any stray voltage from other vessels of
the dock power from causing any damage. My zincs are 20 pound tear
drops and will last 3 years without 50%loss.

Way more seafood if you can hire someone brave enough to challenge the
N. Atlantic to go and get it for you. Here we go and get it for free.

While your boat dries and and starts to shrink and crack and hogg we
will be sailing the gulf or bays year round.

Joe

"Joe" wrote in message
oups.com...
My zincs dont waste away very fast because I have no stray voltage in
my hull. My hull is isolated from all electrical currents bith AC & DC.
I also use a isolater to keep any stray voltage from other vessels of
the dock power from causing any damage. My zincs are 20 pound tear
drops and will last 3 years without 50%loss.

Your neigbouring vessels probably do have stray voltage... and since you see
fit to use a dock like some Power Boater... instead of a Mooring... you are
at risk from them.


Way more seafood if you can hire someone brave enough to challenge the
N. Atlantic to go and get it for you. Here we go and get it for free.

I just walk down to Coolen's Dock and ask Tommy.... I get whatever seafood
I want free as well.


While your boat dries and and starts to shrink and crack and hogg we
will be sailing the gulf or bays year round.

What makes you think a fibreglass vessel shrinks on dry dock?? It
doesn't..... and your one trip out for a 10 mile tour every week hardly
constitutes a lot of use... lets face the facts.... both you and Neal use
your boats like floating trailer homes. It probably takes you 4 hours just
to pack and straighten the vessel for your weekly 4 hour sail.

CM

Capt. Mooron wrote:
"Joe" wrote in message
oups.com...
My zincs dont waste away very fast because I have no stray voltage
in
my hull. My hull is isolated from all electrical currents bith AC &
DC.
I also use a isolater to keep any stray voltage from other vessels
of
the dock power from causing any damage. My zincs are 20 pound tear
drops and will last 3 years without 50%loss.

Your neigbouring vessels probably do have stray voltage... and since
you see
fit to use a dock like some Power Boater... instead of a Mooring...
you are
at risk from them.

Did you miss the part about my voltage isolater? plu I measure stray
voltlage here all the time. Not an issue.


Way more seafood if you can hire someone brave enough to challenge
the
N. Atlantic to go and get it for you. Here we go and get it for
free.

I just walk down to Coolen's Dock and ask Tommy.... I get whatever
seafood
I want free as well.

Here I sail at night and pull a 25 foot sport net that quickly fills
with the freshest bounty the bay has to offer.





While your boat dries and and starts to shrink and crack and hogg
we
will be sailing the gulf or bays year round.

What makes you think a fibreglass vessel shrinks on dry dock??

Because all the moisture contained in plastic boat blisters freeze..
pop...shrink into craters that need to be ground and dug out.. filled
faired painted just to do it all again in 6 mo when you have to haul
again. Not to mention all the soaked core freezing and buckling your
bulworks and decks. Then you have to wait for warm enough weather so
all your plastic putties and goups can set up and dry. If you had a
steel boat you could weld in the coldest weather if needed.

BTW when you going to post pictures of the superior steel vessel under
construction in your local neighborhood?


It
doesn't..... and your one trip out for a 10 mile tour every week
hardly
constitutes a lot of use... lets face the facts.... both you and Neal
use
your boats like floating trailer homes.


RedCloud is my home and outclasses any trailor parked in Canaduh or
the USA.


It probably takes you 4 hours just
to pack and straighten the vessel for your weekly 4 hour sail.


More like 10 min..


Joe

CM

"Lady Pilot" posted:

Nah, now that I'm gone he will turn into the asshole he's always been...

LP


Not nice. Not nice at all.

"The tongue that brings healing is a tree of life,
but a deceitful tongue crushes the spirit." --- Proverbs 15:4

CN

"Joe" wrote in message

BTW when you going to post pictures of the superior steel vessel under
construction in your local neighborhood?

Damn..... I went by there 3 times so far and forgot the camera. I'll do it
tomorrow. I'll post a binary to the group... just because I know it will
**** off the yokels on phone lines or with P3 pieces of junk for computers!

I've been interested in reviewing the costs.... If I took some photos maybe
we could get a thread going on what it would take and cost to have the
vessel sea ready!

CM

You and I think alike in many ways. We may differ as to which is the
proper hull material for a small blue water yacht but we definitely
have our priorities straight in that we choose to live aboard rather
than ashore. We choose freedom over servitude, challenge over
sloth, variety over hum-drum, simplicity over complication, being in
control over being controlled and Mother Nature over works of man.

Ours is the life of a nomad, a warrior, a man in harmony who is not
afraid to face a variety of challenges and to control our own destiny
while employing any number of learned and innate skills to keep our
home and conveyance operational and reliable so that, by the work
of our own hands we trust our very lives. We are men and proud men
at that.

Would that there were more such men here and in the world to keep
it from being the mean and tawdry place it has become of late.

Hope to see you, your stout ship and fine crew on the high seas one of
these days.

Respectfully,
Capt. Neal



"Joe" penned the following perceptive words:

Indeed to suffer a sailing (season) less 6+ mo a years, and to have to
wrap your boat is down right lubbery. To own a boat that is not capable
of living aboard... and not living aboard... put you in the class of the
weekend warriors. And to not have the seatime or ambition to sit for a
Capt. ticket shows no ambition or savy of the way of the sea.....and
again is lubbery. How they can sleep at night without being rocked to
bed is beyond me. Anyone who spends more time ashore than afloat is
lubbery IMHO.

Joe

"Capt. Mooron" wrote in message news:NBHSd.25393$NN.17801@edtnps89...
This would really mean something if the pair of you weren't moored or docked
for 99% of the time. Let's face it.... your time aboard would be better
spent if you both hauled your vessels and did some maintenance for a change.

My vessel was hauled two years ago and the bottom paint (five coats) is still
in fine shape. All that collects on it is some slime that comes off easily with a
soft brush. As for maintenance, what maintenance is needed on a boat that
has four good thru-hulls as drains and nothing more to maintain - not a shaft,
strut,zinc nor a knot log or depth sounder thru-hull?

As an aircraft is better off in the air a sailbot is more lovingly cradled
by water than any contrivance that props her up ashore concentrating
forces in small areas that were not designed to take such forces.

My vessel will age far less drastically than either of yours. Cut The
Mustard no doubt has a saturated hull from extended immersion and Red Cloud
is rusting on a wet berth.

Cut the Mustard's hull is rock solid and will outlast her captain. Any sailor
who worries about a vessel aging to the extent that he puts the vessel up
on shore and lookes at it six or seven months a year is no sailor. Any real
sailor would rather his vessel age gracefully via constant use tempered
with constant care than age slowly with lack of use. Lack of use is anathema
to real sailors and real vessel. Your vessel is treated more like a showboat
and that is truly an insult. A real vessel is a working vessel. Any part-time,
lubberly efforts of forestall the natural order of things is but an exercise
in futility.

Hauling out every season allows me to inspect and maintain my vessel's hull
and submerged components. While I change zincs annually... Joe's 200 zincs
are deteriorating daily. While Capt. Neal's spongy hull is becoming infested
with a marine growth to rival a coral reef.... mine is clear, smooth, hard
and crustacean free. While Cut the Mustard's hull is discolouring...
Overproof's hull is waxed to the waterline and so shiny you can shave in the
reflection. While the pair of you can only entertain wet maintenance.... I
have the luxury of seasonal dry dock overhauls and full access for
maintenance & repairs.

As little as you use your vessel it is a wonder it needs any maintenance at
all. I guess blundering around drunk on week-ends takes it's toll. Boats
that are sailed regularly and year-round are boats that are handled well
while week-end warrior boats are often abused beyond belief. Is it any
wonder why you spend so much time maintaining your vessel?

You pay a price for the convenience of warm weather sailing.... grossly
polluted locations, a plethora of other boats to contend with, advanced
deterioration of equipment, corrosion, complacency as well as exaggerated
mooring & docking fees.

Docking fees are something I do not pay. My mooring is free as God intended
sailing, in general to be free. My location is not polluted. The water is clear
enough to see bottle caps laying on the bottom in ten feet of water. There are
an abuncance of other boats but they are mostly motorboats or sailboats motoring
and once one sails a couple miles offshore one has the ocean all to one's self.

I'll stick to my seasonal sailing regime thank-you very much..... the water
here is deep blue, pristine by comparison and I can actually eat the fish or
shellfish without fear of mercury or other toxic contamination! The fact
that I'm fortunate to even spot 2 or 3 vessels out sailing in the summer is
as well a benefit neither of you enjoy!!

Yes, stick to part-time sailing and keep deluding yourself into thinking you
are a sailor when it's obvious that you are merely a blowhard who is
frustrated and unable to admit he cannot sail as much as he would like
to sail because he has allowed lubberly habits to control his fate and is
too weak-minded and timid to move to climes where sailing is a way of
life and not an escape from reality.

Respectfully,
Capt. Neal
~~~~~~~~~~~~~

There you go taking things seriously like katysails and stealing my bait.
;-)

Love,
LP

"Capt. Neal®" wrote:
"Lady Pilot" posted:

Nah, now that I'm gone he will turn into the asshole he's always been...

LP


Not nice. Not nice at all.
"The tongue that brings healing is a tree of life,
but a deceitful tongue crushes the spirit." --- Proverbs 15:4

CN

Well Well Well....... the sermon on lifestyle from the Moored and Docked!

CM


"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message
...
You and I think alike in many ways. We may differ as to which is the
proper hull material for a small blue water yacht but we definitely
have our priorities straight in that we choose to live aboard rather
than ashore. We choose freedom over servitude, challenge over
sloth, variety over hum-drum, simplicity over complication, being in
control over being controlled and Mother Nature over works of man.

Ours is the life of a nomad, a warrior, a man in harmony who is not
afraid to face a variety of challenges and to control our own destiny
while employing any number of learned and innate skills to keep our
home and conveyance operational and reliable so that, by the work
of our own hands we trust our very lives. We are men and proud men
at that.
Would that there were more such men here and in the world to keep
it from being the mean and tawdry place it has become of late.

Hope to see you, your stout ship and fine crew on the high seas one of
these days.

Respectfully,
Capt. Neal



"Joe" penned the following perceptive words:

Indeed to suffer a sailing (season) less 6+ mo a years, and to have to
wrap your boat is down right lubbery. To own a boat that is not capable of
living aboard... and not living aboard... put you in the class of the
weekend warriors. And to not have the seatime or ambition to sit for a
Capt. ticket shows no ambition or savy of the way of the sea.....and
again is lubbery. How they can sleep at night without being rocked to
bed is beyond me. Anyone who spends more time ashore than afloat is
lubbery IMHO.

Joe

Better than from such as you - the stoned, the shut-in and the lubberly
(not to mention cocksure, crude, crass and craven). Get a life - become
a sailor instead of a land-bound laborer.

CN


"Capt. Mooron" wrote in message news:h4%Sd.26505$NN.5890@edtnps89...
Well Well Well....... the sermon on lifestyle from the Moored and Docked!

CM


"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message ...
You and I think alike in many ways. We may differ as to which is the
proper hull material for a small blue water yacht but we definitely
have our priorities straight in that we choose to live aboard rather
than ashore. We choose freedom over servitude, challenge over
sloth, variety over hum-drum, simplicity over complication, being in
control over being controlled and Mother Nature over works of man.

Ours is the life of a nomad, a warrior, a man in harmony who is not
afraid to face a variety of challenges and to control our own destiny
while employing any number of learned and innate skills to keep our
home and conveyance operational and reliable so that, by the work
of our own hands we trust our very lives. We are men and proud men
at that.
Would that there were more such men here and in the world to keep
it from being the mean and tawdry place it has become of late.

Hope to see you, your stout ship and fine crew on the high seas one of these days.

Respectfully,
Capt. Neal



"Joe" penned the following perceptive words:

Indeed to suffer a sailing (season) less 6+ mo a years, and to have to wrap your boat is down right lubbery. To own a boat that
is not capable of living aboard... and not living aboard... put you in the class of the
weekend warriors. And to not have the seatime or ambition to sit for a
Capt. ticket shows no ambition or savy of the way of the sea.....and
again is lubbery. How they can sleep at night without being rocked to
bed is beyond me. Anyone who spends more time ashore than afloat is
lubbery IMHO.

Joe

I've never been described as C4..... but a change would be required ...
cocksure, cunning, courageous and clever would be acceptable and much closer
to the truth of the matter.

CM

"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message

(not to mention cocksure, crude, crass and craven).

Mooron, I have no need to haul my vessel every year,


Capt. Mooron wrote:
You do but you just can't bother.

Baloney. Why?

Unless forced to do so by weather (in which case you should consider
moving south), the need for underwater repairs or to renew anti-fouling,
you shouldn't haul your boat out of the water at all. It's bad for it.

DSK

"DSK" wrote in message

Unless forced to do so by weather (in which case you should consider
moving south), the need for underwater repairs or to renew anti-fouling,
you shouldn't haul your boat out of the water at all. It's bad for it.

Now I've heard it all.... it's bad to haul your boat out!! Good Grief!

Here's a bit of news... if you are not living on your boat... it's a damned
smart move to haul it when you know for a fact you are not going to use it!
If you do live on your boat and are not underway for extended periods or
enroute.... it most definitely pays to haul your boat on a regular basis!
If you live on a boat tied to a mooring for 90% of the time... a 3 year
haul-out cycle is ridiculously incompetent!

CM

CM

Capt. Mooron wrote:
Now I've heard it all.... it's bad to haul your boat out!! Good Grief!

Do you think it's *good* for it to remove the hull from the even support
of the water, and put it on jackstands or a cradle?


Here's a bit of news... if you are not living on your boat... it's a damned
smart move to haul it when you know for a fact you are not going to use it!

Why? Are you afraid that it might sink because of incompetent maintenance?


If you do live on your boat and are not underway for extended periods or
enroute.... it most definitely pays to haul your boat on a regular basis!

Why?

How can you say "it pays" when it's actually rather expensive?

If you live on a boat tied to a mooring for 90% of the time... a 3 year
haul-out cycle is ridiculously incompetent!


Why?

I named the reasons to haul a boat out of the water. Can you provide
some other reasons to cover your claims?

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

"DSK" wrote in message

I named the reasons to haul a boat out of the water. Can you provide some
other reasons to cover your claims?

Shure....


Do you think it's *good* for it to remove the hull from the even support
of the water, and put it on jackstands or a cradle?

What harm would it do to a proper vessel? The boat flexes more in a seaway
than in the cradle. A proper cradle with sufficent support in no way harms a
vessel... to say otherwise is nonsense.

Why? Are you afraid that it might sink because of incompetent maintenance?

Maybe..... it doesn't take much to sink a vessel. A bad mooring that has
been rented, another vessel breaking loose and impacting your boat, storms,
vandals. Anyone who leaves their boat unattended for extended durations is
tempting Mr. Murphy. I always have someone living aboard my vessel when it's
at the mooring and I find myself out of town working.

If you do live on your boat and are not underway for extended periods or
enroute.... it most definitely pays to haul your boat on a regular
basis!

Why?

For Gawd's sake... maintainence!! If you neglect your hull... the effects
will soon become cumalitive. A sailboat isn't like a fleet trawler that you
can hire a diver to professionally clean the hull everytime you are in port
and provide you with a list of defects requiring attention.

How can you say "it pays" when it's actually rather expensive?

Since when is $75...expensive? A travel lift takes minutes to haul a
vessel. It's cheap!

If you live on a boat tied to a mooring for 90% of the time... a 3 year
haul-out cycle is ridiculously incompetent!

Why?

Well Doug.... nothing grows a garden like a boat that spends the majority
of it's time to a mooring. Barnacles and growth infest beyond the intake
screens. Scrape all you want.... the only way to properly clean and reapply
an annual coat of ablative paint is a haul-out. Tropical waters only act to
speed the process of fouling.

Really Doug... I know you know better than this and are no doubt looking for
a refreshing debate with you playing Devil's Advocate.

CM
..

"DSK" wrote in message

Capt. Mooron wrote:
Now I've heard it all.... it's bad to haul your boat out!! Good Grief!

Do you think it's *good* for it to remove the hull from the even support
of the water, and put it on jackstands or a cradle?

Modern boats (those since all but the earliest days of fiberglass) are
designed to accommodate this necessity. It does them no particular harm, if
done properly.

Here's a bit of news... if you are not living on your boat... it's a
damned smart move to haul it when you know for a fact you are not going
to use it!

Why? Are you afraid that it might sink because of incompetent maintenance?

**** happens. Even the best-maintained boats get hit by storms, runaway
boats, and lightning. Not to mention that a boat on the hard is generally
more difficult to steal.

If you do live on your boat and are not underway for extended periods or
enroute.... it most definitely pays to haul your boat on a regular
basis!

Why?

Myriad reasons. Bottom repaint, check thru-hulls, especially the external
sealant, check the stuffing box (if so equipped) for problems, and so on.
Even Lin and Larry Pardey hauled Seraffin and Taliesin periodically, or at
the very least they blocked them up for painting and inspection at low tide.
So did Susan and Eric Hiscock.

How can you say "it pays" when it's actually rather expensive?

I suppose you've not heard the old adage that an ounce of prevention is
worth a pound of cure. Preventive maintenance saves money. Period.


If you live on a boat tied to a mooring for 90% of the time... a 3 year
haul-out cycle is ridiculously incompetent!


Why?

Why not try it and see. Hell, go for a decade, while you're at it.


Max

Do you think it's *good* for it to remove the hull from the even support
of the water, and put it on jackstands or a cradle?


Capt. Mooron wrote:
What harm would it do to a proper vessel?

Ever heard of sagging or hogging?

... The boat flexes more in a seaway
than in the cradle.

WHAT!!!

If your vessel "flexes in a seaway" then it's either large cargo ship
bridging two big ocean swells, or else it' sadly underbuilt.

... A proper cradle with sufficent support in no way harms a
vessel... to say otherwise is nonsense.


If by "a proper cradle" you mean a custom job with fitted bunks, then
I'd tentatively agree. But most cradles with 4 adjustable pads, or a set
of jackstands, put a great deal of stress on a hull & deck... usually
don't support the boat well enough nor keep it in close enough
alignment, and the result is slow structural degredation.


Why? Are you afraid that it might sink because of incompetent maintenance?


Maybe..... it doesn't take much to sink a vessel.

Nope, just a small leak over a long time... or a big one over a short time.

... A bad mooring that has
been rented, another vessel breaking loose and impacting your boat, storms,
vandals.

???
Sounds like you're boating in the Wild West or some gawd-forsaken
wilderness... oh wait, I forgot, you *are* boating in some gawd-forsaken
wilderness...

... Anyone who leaves their boat unattended for extended durations is
tempting Mr. Murphy.

Agreed, but that's true when it's hauled out as well.

... I always have someone living aboard my vessel when it's
at the mooring and I find myself out of town working.


That sounds like a good arrangement... your brother?


If you do live on your boat and are not underway for extended periods or
enroute.... it most definitely pays to haul your boat on a regular
basis!

Why?


For Gawd's sake... maintainence!! If you neglect your hull... the effects
will soon become cumalitive.

Neglect is stupid & destructive whether the boat is ahsore or afloat...
worse ashore IMHO... especially if it fills with rainwater...


How can you say "it pays" when it's actually rather expensive?


Since when is $75...expensive? A travel lift takes minutes to haul a
vessel. It's cheap!

Well, there you go. Around here (which is one of the least expesnive
places on the East Coast) you can't get a Travel-Lift to turn the key
for less than $200... usually they hit you up for that plus a per-foot
charge...



Why?


Well Doug.... nothing grows a garden like a boat that spends the majority
of it's time to a mooring.

Is that my fault? You can either take the thing out for a spin
occasionally, or hire a local diver to give it a scrub once in a while
(which isn't very expensive, considering the cost of annual haul-out).



Really Doug... I know you know better than this and are no doubt looking for
a refreshing debate with you playing Devil's Advocate.


No, just offering some common sense to offset your assumption that
everybody has their boat moored in some uncivilzed hinterland.

My original statement is completely true: Unless forced to do so by
weather, the need for underwater repairs or to renew anti-fouling, you
shouldn't haul your boat out of the water at all.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Maxprop wrote:
I suppose you've not heard the old adage that an ounce of prevention is
worth a pound of cure. Preventive maintenance saves money. Period.


Where in any of my posts am I suggesting neglect is better than proper
maintenance?

So far, you and Mooron have not mentioned one single circumstance
showing that a haul-out... other than for the few reasons I stated... is
desirable much less necessary,




If you live on a boat tied to a mooring for 90% of the time... a 3 year
haul-out cycle is ridiculously incompetent!


Why?


Why not try it and see. Hell, go for a decade, while you're at it.

It's approaching 2 1/2 years since we hauled uor boat out and I'd go
another year with out hesistating. There's little bottom growth...
attended to by me or a hired a diver... and no reason whatever to haul
it out in the near future... unless I decide to go ahead and install a
bow thruster...

"Ridiculously incompetent"??!?! Get a clue!

DSK

"DSK" wrote in message
. ..
Do you think it's *good* for it to remove the hull from the even support
of the water, and put it on jackstands or a cradle?


Capt. Mooron wrote:
What harm would it do to a proper vessel?

Ever heard of sagging or hogging?

Never in a proper cradle with the rig relaxed.


... The boat flexes more in a seaway than in the cradle.

WHAT!!!

When I slam Overproof into a 20 foot drop off a breaking wave... I assure
you the stress loads exceed that of a lift out on straps and a properly
fitted steel cradle.


If your vessel "flexes in a seaway" then it's either large cargo ship
bridging two big ocean swells, or else it' sadly underbuilt.

... A proper cradle with sufficent support in no way harms a vessel... to
say otherwise is nonsense.


If by "a proper cradle" you mean a custom job with fitted bunks, then I'd
tentatively agree. But most cradles with 4 adjustable pads, or a set of
jackstands, put a great deal of stress on a hull & deck... usually don't
support the boat well enough nor keep it in close enough alignment, and
the result is slow structural degredation.

Sure.. you can lean the damn thing onto a pair of posts as well... but the
majority of people who undertake annual haulouts have a proper cradle for
their vessel... or have one built.




Why? Are you afraid that it might sink because of incompetent
maintenance?


Maybe..... it doesn't take much to sink a vessel.

Nope, just a small leak over a long time... or a big one over a short
time.

... A bad mooring that has been rented, another vessel breaking loose and
impacting your boat, storms, vandals.

???
Sounds like you're boating in the Wild West or some gawd-forsaken
wilderness... oh wait, I forgot, you *are* boating in some gawd-forsaken
wilderness...

... Anyone who leaves their boat unattended for extended durations is
tempting Mr. Murphy.

Agreed, but that's true when it's hauled out as well.

In the yard it's much more difficult to steal from and far easier to explain
to your insurance company.


... I always have someone living aboard my vessel when it's at the
mooring and I find myself out of town working.


That sounds like a good arrangement... your brother?

Friends on vacation, students, family.... it depends... I never have a
problem when asking if anyone would care to babysit a vessel on a mooring,
in a beautiful harbour rent free.



If you do live on your boat and are not underway for extended periods or
enroute.... it most definitely pays to haul your boat on a regular
basis!

Why?


For Gawd's sake... maintainence!! If you neglect your hull... the
effects will soon become cumalitive.

Neglect is stupid & destructive whether the boat is ahsore or afloat...
worse ashore IMHO... especially if it fills with rainwater...


How can you say "it pays" when it's actually rather expensive?


Since when is $75...expensive? A travel lift takes minutes to haul a
vessel. It's cheap!

Well, there you go. Around here (which is one of the least expesnive
places on the East Coast) you can't get a Travel-Lift to turn the key for
less than $200... usually they hit you up for that plus a per-foot
charge...



Why?


Well Doug.... nothing grows a garden like a boat that spends the
majority of it's time to a mooring.

Is that my fault? You can either take the thing out for a spin
occasionally, or hire a local diver to give it a scrub once in a while
(which isn't very expensive, considering the cost of annual haul-out).



Really Doug... I know you know better than this and are no doubt looking
for a refreshing debate with you playing Devil's Advocate.


No, just offering some common sense to offset your assumption that
everybody has their boat moored in some uncivilzed hinterland.

My original statement is completely true: Unless forced to do so by
weather, the need for underwater repairs or to renew anti-fouling, you
shouldn't haul your boat out of the water at all.

That's just incompetent.... regular maintenance would require it.

CM

My original statement is completely true: Unless forced to do so by
weather, the need for underwater repairs or to renew anti-fouling, you
shouldn't haul your boat out of the water at all.


Capt. Mooron wrote:
That's just incompetent.... regular maintenance would require it.


You still haven't shown *what* regular maintenance requires an annual
haul-out!

Fact- our boat is absolutely not lacking for regular maintenance, it's
in great shape. And it hasn't been hauled out in 2 1/2 years. It could
easily go another year IMHO (not sure about the longevity of the bottom
paint, but it couold go even longer) if we weren't thinking about
installing a bow thruster.

DSK

"DSK" wrote in message . ..
If by "a proper cradle" you mean a custom job with fitted bunks, then
I'd tentatively agree. But most cradles with 4 adjustable pads, or a set
of jackstands, put a great deal of stress on a hull & deck... usually
don't support the boat well enough nor keep it in close enough
alignment, and the result is slow structural degredation.

Right you are for once.

Proof is the Irwin 43's and 52's I used to work in back in the late
80s had some nice joinery work and cabinets, bulkheads, etc were
all fitted with the boat in a custom cradle. All the lockers and
doors closed perfectly until the boat was splashed and then in
went the carpenters again to pry many of them open and shave away
the offending wood that made them stick because the hull settled
into a different position in the water.

Mooron is delusional thinking a cradle is a good place for a boat
to be. In the water as much as possible is where a boat belongs.

CN

"DSK" wrote in message

You still haven't shown *what* regular maintenance requires an annual
haul-out!

Antifoul..... I use one that requires reapplication every year. Then again
it's only half as toxic as what you guys must be using...


Fact- our boat is absolutely not lacking for regular maintenance, it's in
great shape. And it hasn't been hauled out in 2 1/2 years. It could easily
go another year IMHO (not sure about the longevity of the bottom paint,
but it couold go even longer) if we weren't thinking about installing a
bow thruster.

What the hell are you using for antifoul Doug???

CM

Capt. Mooron wrote:
Antifoul.....

I said that.

...I use one that requires reapplication every year.

Why?

... Then again
it's only half as toxic as what you guys must be using...


Maybe so. What the heck are you trying to argue about, claiming that not
hauling one's boat out annuall is "incompetent maintenance."



Fact- our boat is absolutely not lacking for regular maintenance, it's in
great shape. And it hasn't been hauled out in 2 1/2 years. It could easily
go another year IMHO (not sure about the longevity of the bottom paint,
but it couold go even longer) if we weren't thinking about installing a
bow thruster.


What the hell are you using for antifoul Doug???


Powdered plutonium ;)

We put on 3 or 4 coats of Petit Trinidad SR and scrub the bottom every 2
months... plus we get underway almost weekly.

I suspect that living in a zone where the water salinity varies widely
over a short distance helps keep our bottom growth down, but the fact
remains that there is no compelling maintenance reason to haul out one's
boat on a schedule.

DSK

I can go to Red Lobster and order any of that.

SV



"Joe" wrote
Here i can sail for 45 min and be dragging a shrimp net that
will fill with shrimp, flounders, crabs, and the occasional redfish
all
most excellent for eating. I can land on a number of oyster reefs
and
rake up 2-3 sack within an hour...a perfect cold weather adventure.
10
mile offshore we have crystal clear blue water with excellent reefs
for
catching Ling, Red Snapper, Groupers, Tuna, Kings, Dolphins, Shark
ect
ect