yes, but when the audience caught on, they were ****ed!
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
Is that where they got the idea for 'wing walkers'?

S
"Scout" wrote in message
...
I think LP's referring to Bart's idea of slowing down the plane,
pretending
to do a prop check, then sneaking a pee.
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
"Lady Pilot" wrote

Where you go for a swim and use that as an opportunity to
urinate.

I would find the nearest airport

and pee out of the airplane?

Scotty

You calling them yellow?

Scotty, BTW, I'll be in W.Chester today and tomorrow.



"Scout" wrote in message
...
yes, but when the audience caught on, they were ****ed!
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
Is that where they got the idea for 'wing walkers'?

S
"Scout" wrote in message
...
I think LP's referring to Bart's idea of slowing down the plane,
pretending
to do a prop check, then sneaking a pee.
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
"Lady Pilot" wrote

Where you go for a swim and use that as an opportunity to
urinate.

I would find the nearest airport

and pee out of the airplane?

Scotty

please say hi to my youngest and most recent monthly tuition bill!
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
You calling them yellow?

Scotty, BTW, I'll be in W.Chester today and tomorrow.



"Scout" wrote in message
...
yes, but when the audience caught on, they were ****ed!
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
Is that where they got the idea for 'wing walkers'?

S
"Scout" wrote in message
...
I think LP's referring to Bart's idea of slowing down the plane,
pretending
to do a prop check, then sneaking a pee.
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
"Lady Pilot" wrote

Where you go for a swim and use that as an opportunity to
urinate.

I would find the nearest airport

and pee out of the airplane?

Scotty

after she/he sobers up, of course.

Scotty
"Scout" wrote in message
...
please say hi to my youngest and most recent monthly tuition bill!
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
You calling them yellow?

Scotty, BTW, I'll be in W.Chester today and tomorrow.



"Scout" wrote in message
...
yes, but when the audience caught on, they were ****ed!
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
Is that where they got the idea for 'wing walkers'?

S
"Scout" wrote in message

...
I think LP's referring to Bart's idea of slowing down the
plane,
pretending
to do a prop check, then sneaking a pee.
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
"Lady Pilot" wrote

Where you go for a swim and use that as an opportunity
to
urinate.

I would find the nearest airport

and pee out of the airplane?

Scotty

he. yes, prolly between noon and 1 would be a good time.
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
after she/he sobers up, of course.

Scotty
"Scout" wrote in message
...
please say hi to my youngest and most recent monthly tuition bill!
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
You calling them yellow?

Scotty, BTW, I'll be in W.Chester today and tomorrow.



"Scout" wrote in message
...
yes, but when the audience caught on, they were ****ed!
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
Is that where they got the idea for 'wing walkers'?

S
"Scout" wrote in message

...
I think LP's referring to Bart's idea of slowing down the
plane,
pretending
to do a prop check, then sneaking a pee.
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
"Lady Pilot" wrote

Where you go for a swim and use that as an opportunity
to
urinate.

I would find the nearest airport

and pee out of the airplane?

Scotty

OzOne wrote:
IIRC, you can use a spinnaker to sail upwind but must not tack with
it.

Why not? This strikes me as an unnecessary rule. Tacking with a
spinnaker is not a good way to get upwind, especially if you're in any
kind of close quarters... ask me how I know!


On an Etchells you'd be blown away with this tactic. VMG to windward
under main and jib is just too good.

Yes it's a great efficient rig. But how about something like a screecher
or Code Zero? Would it be possible to gain enough speed through the
water to make up for the low pointing?

BTW there are a number of fleets where Etchells participate in PHRF
racing as a courtesy (and to bulk up participation) but most places they
prefer fleet racing. Technically, to be eligible for a PHRF rating you
have to have things like a head, a bow pulpit, etc etc. Imagine doing a
distance race on an Etchells!

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

katysails wrote:
We've been chiding him on these points all year....he has probably created
another "non-sailor"....

I think you're wronging Bart on several points. He wanted to go for a
sail, they wanted to go along. If Bart doesn't have a working head on
board, that's a bit of a barrier to longer sails with women on board...
but at least he tried...

DSK

Thanks Doug, The plan was "boys day out sailing".

George bailed out before we left the dock, and the girls invited
themselves along. I warned them. They were careful not to
drink any water either--they knew what they were getting into.

I didn't invite any ladies, just more experienced men. I wanted
to try out that new spinnaker-which turned out to be too big. My
first choice would have been to head upwind which would have
been a wet ride, followed by a deep broad reach back to test it
out. The Port Jeff option, I discussed early, including the time it
would take--about five hours, and I discussed the option of turning
around at Middle Ground--halfway. Fred was particularly keen to
get a response from the women--and one favored it--the other said
nothing--she wet her pants before we got to Middle Ground.

I gave my guests a good ride. Fred drove most of the day--he also
drove up from New Jersey to be there. I wanted him to see what
the boat was all about. Monica took the helm for a while also, and
did much of the sail trim. I didn't touch the helm all day and hardly
touched a sheet. I let them do what they wanted.

By the way, my "bucket" was a flexible Clorox bottle scoop. It's
perfect to **** in--for either sex. Part of being a sailor is being able
to use "the bucket". My 11 year old niece can do it.

"DSK" wrote

katysails wrote:

We've been chiding him on these points all year....he has probably
created
another "non-sailor"....

I think you're wronging Bart on several points. He wanted to go for a
sail, they wanted to go along. If Bart doesn't have a working head on
board, that's a bit of a barrier to longer sails with women on board...
but at least he tried...

DSK

I think my Clorox bottle scoop would do just as well.

"Lady Pilot" wrote

"katysails" wrote:

Next time you take ladies out, Bart, maybe you should invest in this
little
gizmo....


http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs...roductId=35264

Same product that has been offered for years in the aviation business.

I found a comparable product for just five bucks in the children's section
many years ago.

LP

I did a few PHRF races in San Francisco in an Etchells. It was fun!

We would win every start. We came in 4th at one Great Pumpkin
Regatta, out of maybe 90 boats. We were first overall of the fleet
that went clockwise around Angel Island. The three boats that beat
us all went around the island counter clockwise. If you have never
done one of these races, imagine two fleets meeting head on, on beam
reaches on the windward end of the island--exciting stuff, although
I think my skipper pee'd in his pants.

In another race, starting with the smallest boats of three size classes,
we lead the race for all fleets until the last leg when a 60 footer passed
us. We were second overall, and first in our fleet and of course beat
the entire middle sized fleet easily.

Putting an Etchells with trained crew in a PHRF is like putting a wolf
in the chicken shack.

A well cut, lightweight nylon drifter sheeted all the way aft to the
spinnaker
exit blocks would be a great sail for an Etchells in the very light air we
often get on the Sound.

"DSK" wrote
OzOne wrote:
IIRC, you can use a spinnaker to sail upwind but must not tack with
it.

Why not? This strikes me as an unnecessary rule. Tacking with a
spinnaker is not a good way to get upwind, especially if you're in any
kind of close quarters... ask me how I know!


On an Etchells you'd be blown away with this tactic. VMG to windward
under main and jib is just too good.

Yes it's a great efficient rig. But how about something like a screecher
or Code Zero? Would it be possible to gain enough speed through the
water to make up for the low pointing?

BTW there are a number of fleets where Etchells participate in PHRF
racing as a courtesy (and to bulk up participation) but most places they
prefer fleet racing. Technically, to be eligible for a PHRF rating you
have to have things like a head, a bow pulpit, etc etc. Imagine doing a
distance race on an Etchells!

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Most women find men they can't manipulate to be mean.

If I gave you everything you wanted, then I wouldn't be mean.

"Lady Pilot" wrote

"Bart Senior" wrote:
I also enjoy sailing circles around other sailboats. When I'm feeling
particularly mean, I do it twice to rub it in. : )

I find you particularly mean to women. I agree with everything Katysails
has said about you...

LP

"joe" wrote

#1 Isn't it part of good seamanship to cater for the well being of your
crew. Keeping them dry, well fed, rested and happy?

There is no such thing as "dry" on an Etchells.

The ladies had gotten their bottoms wet, and so did I, from maybe
a dozen or so waves that broke over the bow.

I would have provided oilskin pants for the crew or chosen a different
route..

The temp was 70 degrees and peaked at 76 degrees. Water temp was
72 degrees.

It is a mile out of the river. The choice of routes is not relevant;
avoiding the
shoals in the river is relevant. Once in the Sound, the number of options
is
limited.

I dry sail this boat. It is stored on a trailer. It is not worth putting
it in and
hoisting it out, unless I take it out for at least four hours.


Maybe it would have been nice to stop ashore like halfway up the trip to
enable the ladies to comfortably relieve themselves?

Halfway was 7 miles from land. Only a lighthouse surrounded by rocks.
On any other route without an inflatable and outboard, there would have
been no place to stop.


Lot of peeing going on, my guess is that plenty of drinks were served on
the
way. Alcohol? Any concern for the Coast Guard to be lookout for your
Etchells in the future?

You would have guessed wrong. You must be speaking from experience. I'd
guess you drink heavily when you sail.

There was no alcohol on board, only water. Very little of that was drunk.
I
don't bring alcohol when I go sailing. That's for powerboaters, you, and
CM.

This is probably not the way best way to introduce new people to the
wonderful sport of sailing..

Ya think? Maybe if I invited them I would have been better prepared and
chosen
something else like going to a movie.

What would you suggest? Going to a movie?

"Wally" wrote

With a last-minute change of crew, at least one of whom is a non-sailor,
shouldn't the skipper have reappraised the situation and altered the plan
accordingly?

Bart Senior wrote:


"joe" wrote

#1 Isn't it part of good seamanship to cater for the well being of your
crew. Keeping them dry, well fed, rested and happy?

There is no such thing as "dry" on an Etchells.

That's why any experienced keelboat sailor would have brought along proper
clothing, and not have their butts soaked..

If it's warm waterproof shorts might be enough..


It is a mile out of the river. The choice of routes is not relevant;
avoiding the
shoals in the river is relevant. Once in the Sound, the number of options
is
limited.

Maybe it would have been nice to stop ashore like halfway up the trip to
enable the ladies to comfortably relieve themselves?

Halfway was 7 miles from land. Only a lighthouse surrounded by rocks.
On any other route without an inflatable and outboard, there would have
been no place to stop.


"After a quick spin around the Port Jeff harbor, pointing out the hurricane
hole and other feature of this fabulous harbor, to my friend Fred, we
headed out.**I*like*to*learn*about*new*harbors.**It's*alw ays*nice*to*have
local knowledge of choice harbors."

Well, why couldn't you stop there and take a walk ashore to learn more? Or
maybe you are not confident in maneuvering your boat under sail well enough
to enter and dock at new harbors..

Bart Senior wrote:
What would you suggest? Going to a movie?

Was the movie called "Introduction To Sailing"?


--
Wally
www.artbywally.com
www.wally.myby.co.uk

hey Wally, I see lots of water in your paintings, why no sailboats? : )
Scout

"Wally" wrote in message
...
Bart Senior wrote:
What would you suggest? Going to a movie?

Was the movie called "Introduction To Sailing"?


--
Wally
www.artbywally.com
www.wally.myby.co.uk

Scout wrote:
hey Wally, I see lots of water in your paintings, why no sailboats?

It's never occurred to me to include some - maybe they're a bit worldly for
what I'm about with the paintings.


--
Wally
www.artbywally.com
www.wally.myby.co.uk

DSK wrote:


Yes it's a great efficient rig. But how about something like a screecher
or Code Zero? Would it be possible to gain enough speed through the
water to make up for the low pointing?


No, I don't think so -an idea demonstrated by IACC racing. Think about
the apparent wind shifting as speed rises. The key to good upwind
performace is the lift drag ratio. So, we see the benefit of the jib
with it's sharp _stable_ entry for upwind work.

Cheers

Yes it's a great efficient rig. But how about something like a
screecher or Code Zero? Would it be possible to gain enough speed
through the water to make up for the low pointing?


Nav wrote:
No, I don't think so -an idea demonstrated by IACC racing. Think about
the apparent wind shifting as speed rises.

I don't think so either, but it would be fun to check it out. Expensve,
tho'...

... The key to good upwind
performace is the lift drag ratio.

True enough, but the best combined angles are in constant flux. Plus,
the Etchells has much lower aspect ratio rig & foils than an IACC boat.
It's not a good starting point for generalizing. There *might* be some
cases where big light high camber head sail like a screecher or Code 0
might give faster VMG... it would almost certainly be too specialized a
case to be worth pursuing though.

Some boats carry this type of sail all around the course. A few years
back I watched some Windrider Raves (a small foil riding trimaran)
racing, the ones equipped with screechers carried them up wind, much
faster at a lower angle, and beat the ones without quite handily.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

eeeewwwwwww...........
"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
Your link didn't work, but I know what it is. There was one in the Mac
when we bought it. I used it as a funnel to fill the alcohol stove .

Scotty

"katysails" wrote in message
...
Next time you take ladies out, Bart, maybe you should invest in this
little

gizmo.....http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs...rvlet/ProductD
isplay
?storeId=10001&langId=-1&catalogId=10001&productId=35264

Didn't know they made bras that big......

"Horvath" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 09:27:16 +1000, OzOne wrote this crap:


IIRC, you can use a spinnaker to sail upwind but must not tack with
it.

What do you know? I always use a spinnaker upwind, and also two
bloopers. One on each side.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

Or "accidentally" drop your hat in the water and dive in to retrieve it
before anyone can suggest a MOB drill....

"Bart Senior" wrote in message
...
Another option is the notorious "Prop Check"

Where you go for a swim and use that as an opportunity to
urinate.


"Lady Pilot" wrote

"Scott Vernon" wrote:
"Edgar" wrote ...

It is clear from your post that she had
figured out that using the bucket was going to be somewhat
embarassing
anyway but doubly difficult when the boat is 'blasting' across the
bay
probably at a considerable angle of heel.

plus Bart holding his digital camera at the ready prolly didn't help
any.

No doubt, Scott! LOL

LP

He could always have them hang out on a trapeze and just let it fly.....

"Scout" wrote in message
...
I think LP's referring to Bart's idea of slowing down the plane,
pretending
to do a prop check, then sneaking a pee.
Scout

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
"Lady Pilot" wrote

Where you go for a swim and use that as an opportunity to
urinate.

I would find the nearest airport

and pee out of the airplane?

Scotty

Whoa there....I have never said that Bart is mean...misguided,
yes...mean...I don't think so....he just doesn't think in the right
direction sometimes....and he does have his good side....

"Lady Pilot" wrote in message
news:5k91d.44067$mu.31129@okepread07...

"Bart Senior" wrote:
I also enjoy sailing circles around other sailboats. When I'm feeling
particularly mean, I do it twice to rub it in. : )

I find you particularly mean to women. I agree with everything Katysails
has said about you...

LP

In actuality, I know several Polish women and they have no difficulty
what-so-ever expressing themselves....I do think that Bart could have been
more considerate, but then, I don't know the women and maybe they were
constrained by embarrassment....one would think someone on the boat would
have realized that but what's done is done and they will probably never want
to see Bart again.....
"Lady Pilot" wrote in message
news:aa91d.44063$mu.29076@okepread07...

"Bart Senior" wrote:

I hope not.

She was a nice girl. Somewhat shy.

But you still managed to make her **** her pants...

Fred and I asked the ladies if they wanted to head back
after passing Middle Ground, and no one said anything!

Those Polish women aren't used to American men, I would bet on it!

LP (take Katy's advice, really!)

Oh come on, Joe....Etchell's are wet sailors....the women's husband should
have known that and told them to bring the appropriate clothes (like bathing
suits, maybe?) or nylon shorts....His sin is being inconsiderate, not
stupid.....
"joe" wrote in message
...
Bart Senior wrote:


"joe" wrote

#1 Isn't it part of good seamanship to cater for the well being of your
crew. Keeping them dry, well fed, rested and happy?

There is no such thing as "dry" on an Etchells.

That's why any experienced keelboat sailor would have brought along proper
clothing, and not have their butts soaked..

If it's warm waterproof shorts might be enough..


It is a mile out of the river. The choice of routes is not relevant;
avoiding the
shoals in the river is relevant. Once in the Sound, the number of
options
is
limited.

Maybe it would have been nice to stop ashore like halfway up the trip
to
enable the ladies to comfortably relieve themselves?

Halfway was 7 miles from land. Only a lighthouse surrounded by rocks.
On any other route without an inflatable and outboard, there would have
been no place to stop.


"After a quick spin around the Port Jeff harbor, pointing out the
hurricane
hole and other feature of this fabulous harbor, to my friend Fred, we
headed out. I like to learn about new harbors. It's always nice to have
local knowledge of choice harbors."

Well, why couldn't you stop there and take a walk ashore to learn more? Or
maybe you are not confident in maneuvering your boat under sail well
enough
to enter and dock at new harbors..

One would think....
BTW Bart, is the friend still yloour friend?
"Wally" wrote in message
...
Bart Senior wrote:

The plan was boy's day out sailing. The wind looked good for
a fast 27 mile round trip ...

At the last minute one fellow substituted his wife and her sister

The poor gal was too
embarrassed to use the bucket and pee'd in her pants.

It was her first time sailing. Maybe next time, she think about using
the bucket rather than have a wet butt for 6 hours.

With a last-minute change of crew, at least one of whom is a non-sailor,
shouldn't the skipper have reappraised the situation and altered the plan
accordingly?


--
Wally
www.artbywally.com
www.wally.myby.co.uk

A shorter sail.....

"Bart Senior" wrote in message
t...
What would you suggest? Going to a movie?

"Wally" wrote

With a last-minute change of crew, at least one of whom is a non-sailor,
shouldn't the skipper have reappraised the situation and altered the
plan
accordingly?

In time, katy, you will come to appreciate my true genius.

LP, on the other hand, has no hope of ever comprehending me.

"katysails" wrote

Whoa there....I have never said that Bart is mean...misguided,
yes...mean...I don't think so....he just doesn't think in the right
direction sometimes....and he does have his good side....

"Lady Pilot" wrote in message
news:5k91d.44067$mu.31129@okepread07...

"Bart Senior" wrote:
I also enjoy sailing circles around other sailboats. When I'm feeling
particularly mean, I do it twice to rub it in. : )

I find you particularly mean to women. I agree with everything
Katysails
has said about you...

LP

Hey, they were heeled...he could have demonstrated the "hang your butt over"
technique....Expecting people who don't sail to realize the physical limits
that sometimes arise is a mistake....even if he did explain....
"DSK" wrote in message
. ..
katysails wrote:
We've been chiding him on these points all year....he has probably
created
another "non-sailor"....

I think you're wronging Bart on several points. He wanted to go for a
sail, they wanted to go along. If Bart doesn't have a working head on
board, that's a bit of a barrier to longer sails with women on board...
but at least he tried...

DSK

If that was the plan, then when your friend showed up with his women you
should have spoken up and explained yopu were not prepared for non-sailors
and that there would be no facilities so therefore they should change their
plans and go to the beach or something...you are not obligated to
inconvenience your plans for others....by trying to be nice, you ended up
being a jerk....stop trying and just be yourself....
"Bart Senior" wrote in message
t...
Thanks Doug, The plan was "boys day out sailing".

George bailed out before we left the dock, and the girls invited
themselves along. I warned them. They were careful not to
drink any water either--they knew what they were getting into.

I didn't invite any ladies, just more experienced men. I wanted
to try out that new spinnaker-which turned out to be too big. My
first choice would have been to head upwind which would have
been a wet ride, followed by a deep broad reach back to test it
out. The Port Jeff option, I discussed early, including the time it
would take--about five hours, and I discussed the option of turning
around at Middle Ground--halfway. Fred was particularly keen to
get a response from the women--and one favored it--the other said
nothing--she wet her pants before we got to Middle Ground.

I gave my guests a good ride. Fred drove most of the day--he also
drove up from New Jersey to be there. I wanted him to see what
the boat was all about. Monica took the helm for a while also, and
did much of the sail trim. I didn't touch the helm all day and hardly
touched a sheet. I let them do what they wanted.

By the way, my "bucket" was a flexible Clorox bottle scoop. It's
perfect to **** in--for either sex. Part of being a sailor is being able
to use "the bucket". My 11 year old niece can do it.

"DSK" wrote

katysails wrote:

We've been chiding him on these points all year....he has probably
created
another "non-sailor"....

I think you're wronging Bart on several points. He wanted to go for a
sail, they wanted to go along. If Bart doesn't have a working head on
board, that's a bit of a barrier to longer sails with women on board...
but at least he tried...

DSK

"joe" wrote

Bart Senior wrote:

There is no such thing as "dry" on an Etchells.

That's why any experienced keelboat sailor would have brought along proper
clothing, and not have their butts soaked..

If it's warm waterproof shorts might be enough..

Nude sailing makes more sense.

"After a quick spin around the Port Jeff harbor, snip

Well, why couldn't you stop there and take a walk ashore to learn more? Or
maybe you are not confident in maneuvering your boat under sail well
enough
to enter and dock at new harbors..

It would have been fine with me, but everyone wanted to head back.

I like docking under sail--I learned to dock under sail when I was 9.
However,
there was little chance of finding dock space at PJ. My club has a mooring
over
there, but it is a mile from the town. I don't bring a dinghy for day
sailing, and
have no place for an outboard.

These are all great suggestions Joe. You should follow them yourself.

Bart, in reality, you are water and I am oil....I may figure out your
genius, but I doubt I'd ever appreciate it....

"Bart Senior" wrote in message
t...
In time, katy, you will come to appreciate my true genius.

LP, on the other hand, has no hope of ever comprehending me.

"katysails" wrote

Whoa there....I have never said that Bart is mean...misguided,
yes...mean...I don't think so....he just doesn't think in the right
direction sometimes....and he does have his good side....

"Lady Pilot" wrote in message
news:5k91d.44067$mu.31129@okepread07...

"Bart Senior" wrote:
I also enjoy sailing circles around other sailboats. When I'm
feeling
particularly mean, I do it twice to rub it in. : )

I find you particularly mean to women. I agree with everything
Katysails
has said about you...

LP

75 degrees isn't warm enough for nude sailing....

"Bart Senior" wrote in message
t...

"joe" wrote

Bart Senior wrote:

There is no such thing as "dry" on an Etchells.

That's why any experienced keelboat sailor would have brought along
proper
clothing, and not have their butts soaked..

If it's warm waterproof shorts might be enough..

Nude sailing makes more sense.

"After a quick spin around the Port Jeff harbor, snip

Well, why couldn't you stop there and take a walk ashore to learn more?
Or
maybe you are not confident in maneuvering your boat under sail well
enough
to enter and dock at new harbors..

It would have been fine with me, but everyone wanted to head back.

I like docking under sail--I learned to dock under sail when I was 9.
However,
there was little chance of finding dock space at PJ. My club has a
mooring
over
there, but it is a mile from the town. I don't bring a dinghy for day
sailing, and
have no place for an outboard.

These are all great suggestions Joe. You should follow them yourself.

katysails wrote:
If that was the plan, then when your friend showed up with his women you
should have spoken up and explained yopu were not prepared for non-sailors
and that there would be no facilities so therefore they should change their
plans and go to the beach or something...you are not obligated to
inconvenience your plans for others....by trying to be nice, you ended up
being a jerk....stop trying and just be yourself....

Fixing the head would be a good option too...

For some years we kept spare foul weather gear aboard... not the real
good stuff, but adequate for unprepared guests for most weather. We had
one friend show up with one of those K-mart ponchos and insisted he was
OK with that... man did he ever get soaked!

I don't agree that Bart should have changed his plans for guests he
wasn't even expecting. What were his obligations to them? American women
are too spoiled, they expect to be catered to for no reason.

But OTOH it is a good idea to show newbies that sailing is fun... they
can find out about the torture part later! Bart, you may have chased
away potential future crew.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Uh...DOug...I said he shouldn't have changed his plans for them...should
have sent them home...and they were not American women...and since when does
an Etchell's have a head to fix???? I thought they were open daysailors....
"DSK" wrote in message
. ..
katysails wrote:
If that was the plan, then when your friend showed up with his women you
should have spoken up and explained yopu were not prepared for
non-sailors
and that there would be no facilities so therefore they should change
their
plans and go to the beach or something...you are not obligated to
inconvenience your plans for others....by trying to be nice, you ended
up
being a jerk....stop trying and just be yourself....

Fixing the head would be a good option too...

For some years we kept spare foul weather gear aboard... not the real
good stuff, but adequate for unprepared guests for most weather. We had
one friend show up with one of those K-mart ponchos and insisted he was
OK with that... man did he ever get soaked!

I don't agree that Bart should have changed his plans for guests he
wasn't even expecting. What were his obligations to them? American women
are too spoiled, they expect to be catered to for no reason.

But OTOH it is a good idea to show newbies that sailing is fun... they
can find out about the torture part later! Bart, you may have chased
away potential future crew.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

No....but courtesy and politely informing them that this was not the trip
for them was a necessity....Guys I've sailed with have been quite blunt
about it....
OzOne wrote in message ...
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 22:58:16 GMT, "katysails"
scribbled thusly:

Uh...DOug...I said he shouldn't have changed his plans for them...should
have sent them home...and they were not American women...and since when
does
an Etchell's have a head to fix???? I thought they were open
daysailors....

so a head isn't necessary ;-)


Oz1...of the 3 twins.

I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.

DSK wrote:

Yes it's a great efficient rig. But how about something like a
screecher or Code Zero? Would it be possible to gain enough speed
through the water to make up for the low pointing?


Nav wrote:

No, I don't think so -an idea demonstrated by IACC racing. Think about
the apparent wind shifting as speed rises.


I don't think so either, but it would be fun to check it out. Expensve,
tho'...

... The key to good upwind performace is the lift drag ratio.


True enough, but the best combined angles are in constant flux. Plus,
the Etchells has much lower aspect ratio rig & foils than an IACC boat.
It's not a good starting point for generalizing. There *might* be some
cases where big light high camber head sail like a screecher or Code 0
might give faster VMG... it would almost certainly be too specialized a
case to be worth pursuing though.

Some boats carry this type of sail all around the course. A few years
back I watched some Windrider Raves (a small foil riding trimaran)
racing, the ones equipped with screechers carried them up wind, much
faster at a lower angle, and beat the ones without quite handily.


That'll be foils not performing at low speed?

Cheers

Kook! Now you behave. He can't help being a gyandromorph.

Cheers

katysails wrote:

Didn't know they made bras that big......

"Horvath" wrote in message
...

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 09:27:16 +1000, OzOne wrote this crap:


IIRC, you can use a spinnaker to sail upwind but must not tack with
it.

What do you know? I always use a spinnaker upwind, and also two
bloopers. One on each side.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

a grandmamorph?

"Nav" wrote in message
...
Kook! Now you behave. He can't help being a gyandromorph.

Cheers

katysails wrote:

Didn't know they made bras that big......

"Horvath" wrote in message
...

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 09:27:16 +1000, OzOne wrote this crap:


IIRC, you can use a spinnaker to sail upwind but must not tack with
it.

What do you know? I always use a spinnaker upwind, and also two
bloopers. One on each side.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!