Thanks, Spelling Fairy.

Sv

"Donal" wrote in message
...

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
"Bart Senior" wrote

I picked these up after I almost lost a crew overboard. She was
hanging onto the shrouds being dragged through the water.

You really need to get a head on your shoulders.

I've corrected your spelling mistake.

Regards


Donal
--

Michael wrote:
Went to a seminar on singlehanding or single watchstanding safety.

Sounds to me like you got a bucket of BS from some dinosaurs.

... The
panel members have all solo circunavigated.

That's an accomplishment to be proud of, but does it have to be a pulpit
for preaching reliance on 1930s technology & outdated sailing concepts?


1) When securing the vang to the boom don't rely on just the under boom
fitting. Also pass a canvas or cloth strop from the end of the vang over the
boom, under the sail. This works unless you have a bolt rope.

In other words, it's useless unless you have slugs (antiquated) in which
case you'll probably rip the crap out of the sail if a heavy strain
comes on that strap & it tries to slide toward the gooseneck, which it
will... in any event, it will be just as likely to fold up the boom.

Better to put a proper fitting on the boom for the vang, be it a fitted
hard point or a bail with a compression post, and inspect it often
enough to reduce the chance of failure.


2) Instead of relying on the single length tether on your safety harness put
one in the cockpit (two if the foreward one won't reach aft to the wind vane
etc., one by the vang, one by the stays'l and one by the jib/forestay and
anchor area plus one by the mast.

I don't think this is necessarily a bad idea but having an extra tether
banging around & catching on things does not appeal to me. Why not have
just 1 the right length?


... (side note ) I learned to run a second line from the upper end of
the bow pulpit up to just about elbow height on the lower shroud and then
down to the pushpit.

That sounds great, one more obstruction on deck. If you are on a big
boat with wide, unobstructed decks, then that would be a good idea *if*
the rope was very strong, secured very strongly, and kept taut enough to
keep you secure. Otherwise it's just going to help you get hurt... just
my opinion of course...


3) Running Rigging - As a rule of thumb figure they will last 30,000 nm.

??? How do they factor UV exposure per nautical mile?

... Cut
them at least 10' longer than normal.

Do these guys also advocate having baggy wrinkle all over everything?
What cluttered boats they must sail.

Frankly it sounds like the same kind of nonsense the "Cruising Rally"
lecturers are full of. Except for the weather professionals, most of
these guys are just a bunch of blowhards who enjoy telling newbies what
great sailors they are. Maybe I have been too hard on the Crapton, at
least he was amusing sometimes.

Michael, at least your bunch aren't subsidized shills telling you to run
out and buy a lot of fancy gear.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

DSK wrote:



I don't think this is necessarily a bad idea but having an extra tether
banging around & catching on things does not appeal to me. Why not have
just 1 the right length?


The idea is to be able to clip onto a new work point before you unclip
the last point. Anyone who has worked in rough weather on an open deck
knows how wise this is!

Cheers

In article ,
Nav wrote:


DSK wrote:



I don't think this is necessarily a bad idea but having an extra tether
banging around & catching on things does not appeal to me. Why not have
just 1 the right length?


The idea is to be able to clip onto a new work point before you unclip
the last point. Anyone who has worked in rough weather on an open deck
knows how wise this is!

Yup... typically we'll have a short one and a longer one.


--
Jonathan Ganz (j gan z @ $ail no w.c=o=m)
http://www.sailnow.com
"If there's no wind, row."

So the question is: ""What is the right length?" Consider fore deck,
stays'l area, mast, vang, cockpit and stern areas. I have two on my harness
but the idea of one on the mast at least in the much shorter length needed
appealed to me.

That's the new question. How many? What length? Is there a perfect length
for all situations? If not . . .what is your recommendation?

M.


"Nav" wrote in message
...


DSK wrote:



I don't think this is necessarily a bad idea but having an extra tether
banging around & catching on things does not appeal to me. Why not have
just 1 the right length?


The idea is to be able to clip onto a new work point before you unclip
the last point. Anyone who has worked in rough weather on an open deck
knows how wise this is!

Cheers

How about this, both elasticated, one 30" longer than the height of your
harness to the ground the other 30"? The longer one should be clipped at
both ends and the shorter one attached to the harness clip of the longer
one. A double harness line may also help you get back aboard if you go
over the edge. By reaching up an clipping to the toe rail with the other
end you free a loop which you can use to help you up.

Cheers

Michael wrote:

So the question is: ""What is the right length?" Consider fore deck,
stays'l area, mast, vang, cockpit and stern areas. I have two on my harness
but the idea of one on the mast at least in the much shorter length needed
appealed to me.

That's the new question. How many? What length? Is there a perfect length
for all situations? If not . . .what is your recommendation?

M.


"Nav" wrote in message
...


DSK wrote:



I don't think this is necessarily a bad idea but having an extra tether
banging around & catching on things does not appeal to me. Why not have
just 1 the right length?


The idea is to be able to clip onto a new work point before you unclip
the last point. Anyone who has worked in rough weather on an open deck
knows how wise this is!

Cheers

Nav wrote:
...A double harness line may also help you get back aboard if you go
over the edge.

This is *really* bad advice, based on old wives tales.

A harness tether should be short enough to keep you from going over the
side. The odds are high that if you go over the side in very rough
conditions, you will be badly injured and/or drown before you... or
anybody else... can do a thing to assist.

DSK

Michael wrote:
So the question is: ""What is the right length?" Consider fore deck,
stays'l area, mast, vang, cockpit and stern areas.

Do you have to go out on a stern deck, or just in the cockpit & forward?

It's nice to have a padeye to secure to in the cockpit, but it should
(on most boats) be possible to lead a jackstay aft well enough to hook
on as you're standing in the companionway, and stay secured in the
cockpit. It's true that many boats are not practical for this, but then
many boats are overly praised as being super-seaworthy without attention
to detail like this.


... I have two on my harness
but the idea of one on the mast at least in the much shorter length needed
appealed to me.

"Much shorter" as in about a foot or so? That might be nice for working
at the mast, but it wouldn't give you much range of motion. If you have
to stop & unhook & rehook (or vice versa) every time you have to reach
for something, then every deck evolution will be very slow & cumbersome.
Stupid fiddle-faddle like this is why so many people give up on
harnesses... and a certain percent of them are lost...


That's the new question. How many? What length? Is there a perfect length
for all situations? If not . . .what is your recommendation?

I'd recommend one just slightly longer than knee length, and jacklines
from a point well aft to within reaching distance of the bow. Sweat them
down really tight. Yes your tether hook will bang up the deck, but you
can't have everything.

The one time I wore a harness with two tethers (both about 6' long, too
much IMHO), it was necessary... and the second tether was a total PITA.
It got tangled on everything. Eventually I tucked it into my bibs. I
have (and have used on a few other occasions) a harness with one
tether... just a bit shy of 5' long, including a shock-absorbing gather
(which IMHO is a frill.. part of the reason to have a shorter tether is
so that you don't go flying or falling anywhere).

"Nav" wrote in message
The idea is to be able to clip onto a new work point before you unclip
the last point. Anyone who has worked in rough weather on an open deck
knows how wise this is!

"Open deck" as in an Etchells?


Actually, one good use for a second tether would be to hook onto a pad
eye right at your station, so that if the bow goes in hard you won't be
swept the full length of the deck. But that's a rather special case of
"rough weather" and would, for a cruiser, show bad planning more than
anything else IMHO. Admittedly my opinions are not 100% orthodox but I
came by them after a long period of trying to make theory & old wives
tales work as well in practice as they do on chalk boards & story time.

FWIW the vast majority of passagemakers spend less than 5% of their time
in wind over 30 knots... most never see more than 40. A 40 knot blow
ought not be stuffing the bow unless the boat is really unsuitable or
very badly handled. This BTW is fact rather than my opinion.

And there you have it... basically, it's a good example of the old
saying, "if you're gonna be dumb, you gotta be tough."

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Did they give any tips on how to stay awake at he wheel while
singlehanding on an overnight?

Scotty

"Michael" wrote in message
...

Went to a seminar on singlehanding or single watchstanding safety.
The
panel members have all solo circunavigated. Lots of good info but
here are
three I wanted to sha

1) When securing the vang to the boom don't rely on just the under
boom
fitting. Also pass a canvas or cloth strop from the end of the vang
over the
boom, under the sail. This works unless you have a bolt rope. The
idea is to
put the strain on the top of the boom and spread it out rather than
on a
fitting underneath that will eventually break due to fatigue of
metal.

2) Instead of relying on the single length tether on your safety
harness put
one in the cockpit (two if the foreward one won't reach aft to the
wind vane
etc., one by the vang, one by the stays'l and one by the
jib/forestay and
anchor area plus one by the mast. Make each one the right length for
what
you are doing. For example the one at the mast should be short,
maybe a foot
to 18". Then use the regular one to get from spot to spot along the
jacklines. (side note ) I learned to run a second line from the
upper end of
the bow pulpit up to just about elbow height on the lower shroud and
then
down to the pushpit. Set so that boom and jib sheet etc. clear. When
go
forward in rough seas you have deck jackline, toe rail, two
lifelines (to
30" high) and this higher line so you are caught toe, above the knee
and
just below the shoulder.

3) Running Rigging - As a rule of thumb figure they will last 30,000
nm. Cut
them at least 10' longer than normal. Then every 3,000 nm cut off a
foot and
move everything along the route, through the blocks etc, to a new
sport.
This keeps the line from wearing in only one spot as it lays in the
sheaves.
Also means you don't have to end for end quite so much. That can be
done at
15,000 nm at which point you reverse the procedure. So there's three
good
ideas I came away with!

Michael

Scott Vernon wrote:
Did they give any tips on how to stay awake at he wheel while
singlehanding on an overnight?


Use the Bart method: Drink plenty of fluids and pee a lot into a Clorox bottle!

Cheers
Marty