On Tue, 27 Jan 2004, "John Cairns" wrote:

Pretty clever, if your wheel takes up as much space
in your cockpit as mine does. Don't say anything about
wheels vs. tillers, mine came with the boat, seems
to be the habit amongst most builders these days.

http://www.lewmar.com/news/news_display.asp?newsid=140

An alternative on the new-model Beneteaus is to have a pivoting
steering column ("a patented wheel that rotates 90 degrees -
Beneteau's answer to the industry-wide desire to open the passage
straight through the cockpit from the transom, and . . . simpler than
twin helm stations"). See, http://beneteauusa.com/news/323.php

Lewmar, like Beneteau (in a somewhat different way), advertises "fast
action" in the folding/unfolding mechanism (or, in Benteau's case, of
the wheel's pivoting); and I don't doubt that each has tested their
devices in stressful conditions.

Still, I remain skeptical about safety, if one tries to use (whichever
of these) thing(s) while operating the boat boat and, if one wants
wants extra space or relatedly more cockpit ingress/egress while on a
mooring or at anchor or in a slip, why not simply (for most, in just a
few seconds - right?) just unscrew the wheel and lash it to some
secure and more out-of-the-way place?

"John Cairns" wrote:
Pretty clever, if your wheel takes up as much space
in your cockpit as mine does. Don't say anything about
wheels vs. tillers, mine came with the boat, seems
to be the habit amongst most builders these days.

http://www.lewmar.com/news/news_display.asp?newsid=140

Now, that's clever. Why don't they just have an inflatable steering wheel,
that'd get out of the way pretty quick.


wrote:
An alternative on the new-model Beneteaus is to have a pivoting
steering column ("a patented wheel that rotates 90 degrees -
Beneteau's answer to the industry-wide desire to open the passage
straight through the cockpit from the transom, and . . . simpler than
twin helm stations"). See, http://beneteauusa.com/news/323.php

Now that's cool, especially if you can still steer with it rotated to the
side. It's like a hiking stick for a steering wheel!



Lewmar, like Beneteau (in a somewhat different way), advertises "fast
action" in the folding/unfolding mechanism (or, in Benteau's case, of
the wheel's pivoting); and I don't doubt that each has tested their
devices in stressful conditions.

hmmm, not so sure. A lot of times these kinds of things are fine until the
boat is driving hard and then hits a wave, throwing the helmsman's (or a
couple of peoples) weight against it.



Still, I remain skeptical about safety, if one tries to use (whichever
of these) thing(s) while operating the boat boat and, if one wants
wants extra space or relatedly more cockpit ingress/egress while on a
mooring or at anchor or in a slip, why not simply (for most, in just a
few seconds - right?) just unscrew the wheel and lash it to some
secure and more out-of-the-way place?

My wife and I chartered a boat a few years ago that had a quick release
hub on the steering wheel. While it did free up the cockpit a bit for
partying, we both thought it was a stupd feature. Maybe it would make
sense for a live aboard who spent long periods using the cockpit for other
functions. Call me old fashioned, I don't mind that the cockpit of my
sailboat is a bit inconvenient for other things, and less like a suburban
patio or tiki bar, as long as it is efficient & effective for sailing.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Or better yet, one of these, works like a wheel or a tiller and doesn't take
up that much room. Haven't seen it on any boat other than the ETAP.
http://www.etapyachting.com/index.cf...pments&Start=3
John Cairns
"DSK" wrote in message
...
"John Cairns" wrote:
Pretty clever, if your wheel takes up as much space
in your cockpit as mine does. Don't say anything about
wheels vs. tillers, mine came with the boat, seems
to be the habit amongst most builders these days.

http://www.lewmar.com/news/news_display.asp?newsid=140

Now, that's clever. Why don't they just have an inflatable steering wheel,
that'd get out of the way pretty quick.


wrote:
An alternative on the new-model Beneteaus is to have a pivoting
steering column ("a patented wheel that rotates 90 degrees -
Beneteau's answer to the industry-wide desire to open the passage
straight through the cockpit from the transom, and . . . simpler than
twin helm stations"). See, http://beneteauusa.com/news/323.php

Now that's cool, especially if you can still steer with it rotated to the
side. It's like a hiking stick for a steering wheel!



Lewmar, like Beneteau (in a somewhat different way), advertises "fast
action" in the folding/unfolding mechanism (or, in Benteau's case, of
the wheel's pivoting); and I don't doubt that each has tested their
devices in stressful conditions.

hmmm, not so sure. A lot of times these kinds of things are fine until the
boat is driving hard and then hits a wave, throwing the helmsman's (or a
couple of peoples) weight against it.



Still, I remain skeptical about safety, if one tries to use (whichever
of these) thing(s) while operating the boat boat and, if one wants
wants extra space or relatedly more cockpit ingress/egress while on a
mooring or at anchor or in a slip, why not simply (for most, in just a
few seconds - right?) just unscrew the wheel and lash it to some
secure and more out-of-the-way place?

My wife and I chartered a boat a few years ago that had a quick release
hub on the steering wheel. While it did free up the cockpit a bit for
partying, we both thought it was a stupd feature. Maybe it would make
sense for a live aboard who spent long periods using the cockpit for other
functions. Call me old fashioned, I don't mind that the cockpit of my
sailboat is a bit inconvenient for other things, and less like a suburban
patio or tiki bar, as long as it is efficient & effective for sailing.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

John Cairns wrote:

Or better yet, one of these, works like a wheel or a tiller and doesn't take
up that much room. Haven't seen it on any boat other than the ETAP.
http://www.etapyachting.com/index.cf...pments&Start=3

Is there a picture on their web site? All I found was this:
"1. EVS ® (ETAP Vertical Steering) System
Instead of a standard hand tiller, the ETAP 32s can be fitted with the
revolutionary ETAP Vertical Steering (EVS ® ) system. The boat is steered via an
ergonomically-shaped control which moves in the vertical plane athwartships. The
EVS ® system combines the precision of a tiller with the advantages of a wheel,
while eliminating the disadvantages of both. The EVS ® system is supplied with
two teak seats and an emergency hand tiller. "

Sounds like they've re-invented the whipstaff. I'd like to give it a try,
though, it sounds pretty cool. I've seen a couple of Etap boats, one 35-ish
footer at a boat show and a couple of their smaller trailerables. They seem like
pretty good boats.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Weird, that is the link on the page with the picture of the vertical tiller.
Enter the sailing section in English, the page displayed will have a column
on the left side, at the bottom of the column click on "developments" when
you get to that page, at the bottom click on "back to list", the page
displayed has a link to the EVS page. Almost like they don't want anyone to
see the thing!
John Cairns
"DSK" wrote in message
...


John Cairns wrote:

Or better yet, one of these, works like a wheel or a tiller and doesn't
take
up that much room. Haven't seen it on any boat other than the ETAP.

http://www.etapyachting.com/index.cf...pments&Start=3

Is there a picture on their web site? All I found was this:
"1. EVS ® (ETAP Vertical Steering) System
Instead of a standard hand tiller, the ETAP 32s can be fitted with the
revolutionary ETAP Vertical Steering (EVS ® ) system. The boat is steered
via an
ergonomically-shaped control which moves in the vertical plane
athwartships. The
EVS ® system combines the precision of a tiller with the advantages of a
wheel,
while eliminating the disadvantages of both. The EVS ® system is supplied
with
two teak seats and an emergency hand tiller. "

Sounds like they've re-invented the whipstaff. I'd like to give it a try,
though, it sounds pretty cool. I've seen a couple of Etap boats, one
35-ish
footer at a boat show and a couple of their smaller trailerables. They
seem like
pretty good boats.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

John Cairns wrote:

Weird, that is the link on the page with the picture of the vertical tiller.

Your post shows it as a link, but the web page strips the second part of the
address and just takes me to the Etap Yachts web site home page. If I type it
in, I get the verbal description but the pic is a broken link.

I'm using an old browser, that could be part of it.


Enter the sailing section in English, the page displayed will have a column
on the left side, at the bottom of the column click on "developments" when
you get to that page, at the bottom click on "back to list", the page
displayed has a link to the EVS page. Almost like they don't want anyone to
see the thing!

Likely it's a programming problem, or maybe it's one of those "best viewed with
Micro$oft" coded web sites.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Try this one:
http://www.etapyachting.com/index.cf...ments&Type=Lis
t

"DSK" wrote in message
...
John Cairns wrote:

Weird, that is the link on the page with the picture of the vertical
tiller.

Your post shows it as a link, but the web page strips the second part of
the
address and just takes me to the Etap Yachts web site home page. If I type
it
in, I get the verbal description but the pic is a broken link.

I'm using an old browser, that could be part of it.


Enter the sailing section in English, the page displayed will have a
column
on the left side, at the bottom of the column click on "developments"
when
you get to that page, at the bottom click on "back to list", the page
displayed has a link to the EVS page. Almost like they don't want anyone
to
see the thing!

Likely it's a programming problem, or maybe it's one of those "best viewed
with
Micro$oft" coded web sites.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

I give up. I think they want you to have to visit parts of the website
before you visit this particular page. You would think they want to crow
about their "development".
John Cairns