What to love about the United States.
 

America provides an amazingly good life for the ordinary guy.: Rich people live well everywhere. But what distinguishes
America is that it provides an impressively high standard of living for the "common man." We now live in a country where
construction workers regularly pay $4 for a nonfat latte, where maids drive nice cars, and where plumbers take their families on
vacation to Europe.

Indeed newcomers to the United States are struck by the amenities enjoyed by "poor" people in the United States. This fact was
dramatized in the 1980s when CBS television broadcast a documentary, People Like Us, which was intended to show the miseries of the
poor during an ongoing recession. The Soviet Union also broadcast the documentary, with a view to embarrassing the Reagan
administration. But by the testimony of former Soviet leaders, it had the opposite effect. Ordinary people across the Soviet Union
saw that the poorest Americans have TV sets, microwave ovens, and cars. They arrived at the same perception that I witnessed in an
acquaintance of mine from Bombay who has been unsuccessfully trying to move to the United States. I asked him, "Why are you so eager
to come to America?" He replied, "I really want to live in a country where the poor people are fat."

America offers more opportunity and social mobility than any other country, including the countries of Europe: America is the
only country that has created a population of "self-made tycoons." Only in America could Pierre Omidyar, whose parents are Iranian
and who grew up in Paris, have started a company like eBay. Only in America could Vinod Khosla, the son of an Indian army officer,
become a leading venture capitalist, the shaper of the technology industry, and a billionaire to boot. Admittedly tycoons are not
typical, but no country has created a better ladder than America for people to ascend from modest circumstances to success.

Work and trade are respectable in America, which is not true elsewhe Historically most cultures have despised the merchant
and the laborer, regarding the former as vile and corrupt and the latter as degraded and vulgar. Some cultures, such as that of
ancient Greece and medieval Islam, even held that it is better to acquire things through plunder than through trade or contract
labor. But the American founders altered this moral hierarchy. They established a society in which the life of the businessman, and
of the people who worked for him, would be a noble calling. In the American view, there is nothing vile or degraded about serving
your customers either as a CEO or as a waiter. The ordinary life of production and supporting a family is more highly valued in the
United States than in any other country. Indeed America is the only country in the world where we call the waiter "sir," as if he
were a knight.

America has achieved greater social equality than any other society.: True, there are large inequalities of income and wealth
in America. In purely economic terms, Europe is more egalitarian. But Americans are socially more equal than any other people, and
this is unaffected by economic disparities. Tocqueville noticed this egalitarianism a century and a half ago, but it is if anything
more prevalent today. For all his riches, Bill Gates could not approach the typical American and say, "Here's a $100 bill. I'll give
it to you if you kiss my feet." Most likely the person would tell Gates to go to hell! The American view is that the rich guy may
have more money, but he isn't in any fundamental sense better than anyone else.

People live longer, fuller lives in America.: Although protesters rail against the American version of technological
capitalism at trade meetings around the world, in reality the American system has given citizens many more years of life, and the
means to live more intensely and actively. In 1900, the life expectancy in America was around 50 years; today, it is more than 75
years. Advances in medicine and agriculture are mainly responsible for the change. This extension of the life-span means more years
to enjoy life, more free time to devote to a good cause, and more occasions to do things with the grandchildren. In many countries,
people who are old seem to have nothing to do: They just wait to die. In America the old are incredibly vigorous, and people in
their seventies pursue the pleasures of life, including remarriage and sexual gratification, with a zeal that I find unnerving.

In America the destiny of the young is not given to them but created by them.: Not long ago, I asked myself, "What would my
life have been like if I had never come to the United States?" If I had remained in India, I would probably have lived my whole life
within a five-mile radius of where I was born. I would undoubtedly have married a woman of my identical religious and socioeconomic
background. I would almost certainly have become a medical doctor, or an engineer, or a computer programmer. I would have socialized
entirely within my ethic community. I would have a whole set of opinions that could be predicted in advance; indeed, they would not
be very different from what my father believed, or his father before him. In sum, my destiny would to a large degree have been given
to me.

In America, I have seen my life take a radically different course. In college I became interested in literature and politics,
and I resolved to make a career as a writer. I married a woman whose ancestry is English, French, Scotch-Irish, German, and American
Indian. In my twenties I found myself working as a policy analyst in the White House, even though I was not an American citizen. No
other country, I am sure, would have permitted a foreigner to work in its inner citadel of government.

In most countries in the world, your fate and your identity are handed to you; in America, you determine them for yourself.
America is a country where you get to write the script of your own life. Your life is like a blank sheet of paper, and you are the
artist. This notion of being the architect of your own destiny is the incredibly powerful idea that is behind the worldwide appeal
of America. Young people especially find irresistible the prospect of authoring the narrative of their own lives.

America has gone further than any other society in establishing equality of rights.: There is nothing distinctively American
about slavery or bigotry. Slavery has existed in virtually every culture, and xenophobia, prejudice, and discrimination are
worldwide phenomena. Western civilization is the only civilization to mount a principled campaign against slavery; no country
expended more treasure and blood to get rid of slavery than the United States. While racism remains a problem in America, this
country has made strenuous efforts to eradicate discrimination, even to the extent of enacting policies that give legal preference
in university admissions, jobs, and government contracts to members of minority groups. Such policies remain controversial, but the
point is that it is extremely unlikely that a racist society would have permitted such policies in the first place. And surely
African Americans like Jesse Jackson are vastly better off living in America than they would be if they were to live in, say,
Ethiopia or Somalia.

America has found a solution to the problem of religious and ethnic conflict that continues to divide and terrorize much of
the world.: Visitors to places like New York are amazed to see the way in which Serbs and Croatians, Sikhs and Hindus, Irish
Catholics and Irish Protestants, Jews and Palestinians, all seem to work and live together in harmony. How is this possible when
these same groups are spearing each other and burning each other's homes in so many places in the world?

The American answer is twofold. First, separate the spheres of religion and government so that no religion is given official
preference but all are free to practice their faith as they wish. Second, do not extend rights to racial or ethnic groups but only
to individuals; in this way, all are equal in the eyes of the law, opportunity is open to anyone who can take advantage of it, and
everybody who embraces the American way of life can "become American."

Of course there are exceptions to these core principles, even in America. Racial preferences are one such exception, which
explains why they are controversial. But in general America is the only country in the world that extends full membership to
outsiders. The typical American could come to India, live for 40 years, and take Indian citizenship. But he could not "become
Indian." He wouldn't see himself that way, nor would most Indians see him that way. In America, by contrast, hundreds of millions
have come from far-flung shores and over time they, or at least their children, have in a profound and full sense "become American."

America has the kindest, gentlest foreign policy of any great power in world history.: Critics of the U.S. are likely to react
to this truth with sputtering outrage. They will point to longstanding American support for a Latin or Middle Eastern despot, or the
unjust internment of the Japanese during World War II, or America's reluctance to impose sanctions on South Africa's apartheid
regime. However one feels about these particular cases, let us concede to the critics the point that America is not always in the
right.

What the critics leave out is the other side of the ledger. Twice in the 20th century, the United States saved the world:
first from the Nazi threat, then from Soviet totalitarianism. What would have been the world's fate if America had not existed?
After destroying Germany and Japan in World War II, the U.S. proceeded to rebuild both countries, and today they are American
allies. Now we are doing the same thing in Afghanistan and Iraq. Consider, too, how magnanimous the U.S. has been to the former
Soviet Union after its victory in the Cold War. For the most part America is an abstaining superpower: It shows no real interest in
conquering and subjugating the rest of the world. (Imagine how the Soviets would have acted if they had won the Cold War.) On
occasion the America intervenes to overthrow a tyrannical regime or to halt massive human rights abuses in another country, but it
never stays to rule that country. In Grenada, Haiti, and Bosnia, the U.S. got in and then it got out. Moreover, when America does
get into a war, as in Iraq, its troops are supremely careful to avoid targeting civilians and to minimize collateral damage. Even as
America bombed the Taliban infrastructure and hideouts, U.S. planes dropped rations of food to avert hardship and starvation of
Afghan civilians. What other country does these things?

America, the freest nation on earth, is also the most virtuous nation on earth.: This point seems counter-intuitive, given the
amount of conspicuous vulgarity, vice, and immorality in America. Indeed some Islamic fundamentalists argue that their regimes are
morally superior to the United States because they seek to foster virtue among the citizens. Virtue, these fundamentalists argue, is
a higher principle than liberty.

Indeed it is. And let us admit that in a free society, freedom will frequently be used badly. Freedom, by definition, includes
the freedom to do good or evil, to act nobly or basely. But if freedom brings out the worst in people, it also brings out the best.
The millions of Americans who live decent, praiseworthy lives desire our highest admiration because they have opted for the good
when the good is not the only available option. Even amidst the temptations of a rich and free society, they have remained on the
straight path. Their virtue has special luster because it is freely chosen.

By contrast, the societies that many Islamic fundamentalists seek would eliminate the possibility of virtue. If the supply of
virtue is insufficient in a free society like America, it is almost non-existent in an unfree society like Iran. The reason is that
coerced virtues are not virtues at all. Consider the woman who is required to wear a veil. There is no modesty in this, because she
is being compelled Compulsion cannot produce virtue, it can only produce the outward semblance of virtue. Thus a free society like
America is not merely more prosperous, more varied, more peaceful, and more tolerant — it is also morally superior to the theocratic
and authoritarian regimes that America's enemies advocate.

"To make us love our country," Edmund Burke once said, "our country ought to be lovely." Burke's point is that we should love
our country not just because it is ours, but also because it is good. America is far from perfect, and there is lots of room for
improvement. In spite of its flaws, however, the American life as it is lived today is the best life that our world has to offer.
Ultimately America is worthy of our love and sacrifice because, more than any other society, it makes possible the good life, and
the life that is good.

— Dinesh D'Souza's best-selling book What's So Great About America has just been published in paperback by Penguin Books. He
is the Rishwain Fellow at the Hoover Institution at Stanford University.

What to love about the United States.
 

I've heard Dinesh D'Souza speak, and I like most of what he says. However,
when he speaks of plumbers and waiters and other such workers, and is in awe
that they have some cash and some rights, he also needs to know that it was
plumbers and waiters construction workers who fought, suffered, and often
died to make America what it is today.

We now live in a country where construction workers regularly pay $4 for a
nonfat latte
where maids drive nice cars, and where plumbers take their families on
vacation to Europe.
- Which is how it should be.

"I really want to live in a country where the poor people are fat."
- this is true

no country has created a better ladder than America for people to ascend
from modest circumstances to success.
- this is true

Work and trade are respectable in America
- They deserve respect, but America still looks down on the tradespeople,
big mistake. This is not true in some other places, like Germany, where the
trades are honored. In America, we send our academically failing students,
behavior problems, malcontents, and social misfits to the Vocational high
schools to learn a trade. It is only the trade unions who are seeing
through this farce, and they recruit new members not from vocational high
schools, but from colleges. Trade Union members are told to not send their
children to vocational high schools. How sad this is that the educational
systems has *******ized an ancient and proven system of apprenticing.

In the American view, there is nothing vile or degraded about serving your
customers either as a CEO or as a waiter.
- Unfortunately, neither is likely to get good service. Try dealing with the
IRS, any insurance agency, any governmental agency, any business with more
than 50 employees. Good luck.

Indeed America is the only country in the world where we call the waiter
"sir," as if he were a knight.
- I was a waiter when I was a young college student, so I can't agree with
this one. People, especially our visiting neighbors from New York, treated
us like ****. Then they typically stiffed us for a tip. Meanwhile, food
workers make less than minimum wage.


For all his riches, Bill Gates could not approach the typical American
and say, "Here's a $100 bill. I'll give
it to you if you kiss my feet." Most likely the person would tell Gates
to go to hell!
- He should visit Times Square, people are doing a lot more than kiss feet
for a lot less money.

Scout

What to love about the United States.
 

Even lawyers are unemployed.

There's too many. This is a fact not just lawyer bashing. Look at your phone
book. Lawyers probably account for 5% of your phone book. It's the reason for
the increasingly creative law suits.
S/V Express 30 "Ringmaster"
Trains are a winter sport

What to love about the United States.
 

Watch the housing bubble burst

Yea people have been saying that forever. 50 years ago my father was offered
the chance to buy ocean front property in Ocean City, Md for $100 an acre. He
said someday they will be giving that away. As anyone can probably figure out
that never happened.
S/V Express 30 "Ringmaster"
Trains are a winter sport

What to love about the United States.
 

Unemployment has skyrocketed lately. I've got lots of friends in
high tech that are really hurting.

"Gilligan" wrote in message
thlink.net...
What you have described here is America of the past.

Let's take a look at the futu

The law of the land, the US Constitution is becoming less and less
relevant.

Spending under the Bush administrations first three years has gone up
13.5%.
The same time duration under Clinton only yielded an increase of 3.3%. Of
the five largest yearly increases in the federal budget in history, three
have occured under Bush. His legacy as governor of Texas confirms he is
all
for big spending and big government. Less than 1/2 of Bush's spending was
for the military, the rest entitlements. He has saddled our future with
big
government and the costs that go along with it.

Today, where is the opportunity? The only engineering and science jobs are
with the military-industrial complex. Even lawyers are unemployed. Health
insurance costs have gone up 30% in the last year for many companies. Look
at the costs businesses are saddled with due to government legislation.
Health care, social security, unemployment, OSHA, etc, etc. That's why
many
jobs are going overseas, it simply costs too much to hire someone here.
It's
the overhead, not the wage.

Why hasn't the economy pulled out of the recession? After all, people
trained in economics have been predicting a pullout for years now. Watch
the
housing bubble burst. All those people with jobs in the trades will be
unemployed. People who have overmortgaged their houses will be paying on
loans worth nothing. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are on real shaky ground.
If
low interest rates spur the economy, and we have the lowest rates since
1958, why isn't the economy booming? Why is there no risk taking in the
economy?

America is loosing good paying jobs rapidly. It's common to hear of
someone
who three years ago was a physicist working on some new amazing technology
making 100K a year, now driving a delivery truck for $12.50 an hour. The
creative edge of our economy is no longer valued. The only job
opportunities
that exist are in services, which are low paying and create no wealth.

The Republicans were our last stand against big, expensive and encroaching
government. They have let us down. We were swindled.

Tax cuts? What good are they when other costs go up because of government?

The best thing one can do is pack up your sailboat and go to a country
where
it costs less to live. Have your stipend checks mailed to you and only
come
back for health care. If you don't get checks from the government to live
on, or don't have the government paying your health care or don't have the
government as an employer, then you are hosed. Get a job in the
underground
economy, because your PhD means nothing when you are pushing a mower. If
you
push the mower legitimately you'll need licenses, permits, compliance
certificates, an accountant, a lawyer, etc. A ten dollar lawn job now must
support 40 dollars in government overhead - if you let it.

If you love America, read and know the Constitution. Look at what our
government has become. Is this what the Constitution intended?

If you want to see our economic future, look to Europe. In the past
America
has pulled out of economic slumps. But no administration in peacetime
history has grown the Leviathen as the current administration, supposed
defenders of liberty. Next election get out and vote. Vote for gridlock,
it's our only hope until another Goldwater or Reagan comes along.

Gilligan







"jlrogers" wrote in message
.. .
America provides an amazingly good life for the ordinary guy.:
Rich
people live well everywhere. But what distinguishes
America is that it provides an impressively high standard of living for
the "common man." We now live in a country where
construction workers regularly pay $4 for a nonfat latte, where maids
drive nice cars, and where plumbers take their families on
vacation to Europe.

Indeed newcomers to the United States are struck by the amenities
enjoyed by "poor" people in the United States. This fact was
dramatized in the 1980s when CBS television broadcast a documentary,
People Like Us, which was intended to show the miseries of the
poor during an ongoing recession. The Soviet Union also broadcast the
documentary, with a view to embarrassing the Reagan
administration. But by the testimony of former Soviet leaders, it had
the
opposite effect. Ordinary people across the Soviet Union
saw that the poorest Americans have TV sets, microwave ovens, and cars.
They arrived at the same perception that I witnessed in an
acquaintance of mine from Bombay who has been unsuccessfully trying to
move to the United States. I asked him, "Why are you so eager
to come to America?" He replied, "I really want to live in a country
where
the poor people are fat."

America offers more opportunity and social mobility than any other
country, including the countries of Europe: America is the
only country that has created a population of "self-made tycoons." Only
in
America could Pierre Omidyar, whose parents are Iranian
and who grew up in Paris, have started a company like eBay. Only in
America could Vinod Khosla, the son of an Indian army officer,
become a leading venture capitalist, the shaper of the technology
industry, and a billionaire to boot. Admittedly tycoons are not
typical, but no country has created a better ladder than America for
people to ascend from modest circumstances to success.

Work and trade are respectable in America, which is not true
elsewhe Historically most cultures have despised the merchant
and the laborer, regarding the former as vile and corrupt and the latter
as degraded and vulgar. Some cultures, such as that of
ancient Greece and medieval Islam, even held that it is better to
acquire
things through plunder than through trade or contract
labor. But the American founders altered this moral hierarchy. They
established a society in which the life of the businessman, and
of the people who worked for him, would be a noble calling. In the
American view, there is nothing vile or degraded about serving
your customers either as a CEO or as a waiter. The ordinary life of
production and supporting a family is more highly valued in the
United States than in any other country. Indeed America is the only
country in the world where we call the waiter "sir," as if he
were a knight.

America has achieved greater social equality than any other
society.: True, there are large inequalities of income and wealth
in America. In purely economic terms, Europe is more egalitarian. But
Americans are socially more equal than any other people, and
this is unaffected by economic disparities. Tocqueville noticed this
egalitarianism a century and a half ago, but it is if anything
more prevalent today. For all his riches, Bill Gates could not approach
the typical American and say, "Here's a $100 bill. I'll give
it to you if you kiss my feet." Most likely the person would tell Gates
to
go to hell! The American view is that the rich guy may
have more money, but he isn't in any fundamental sense better than
anyone
else.

People live longer, fuller lives in America.: Although protesters
rail against the American version of technological
capitalism at trade meetings around the world, in reality the American
system has given citizens many more years of life, and the
means to live more intensely and actively. In 1900, the life expectancy
in
America was around 50 years; today, it is more than 75
years. Advances in medicine and agriculture are mainly responsible for
the
change. This extension of the life-span means more years
to enjoy life, more free time to devote to a good cause, and more
occasions to do things with the grandchildren. In many countries,
people who are old seem to have nothing to do: They just wait to die. In
America the old are incredibly vigorous, and people in
their seventies pursue the pleasures of life, including remarriage and
sexual gratification, with a zeal that I find unnerving.

In America the destiny of the young is not given to them but
created
by them.: Not long ago, I asked myself, "What would my
life have been like if I had never come to the United States?" If I had
remained in India, I would probably have lived my whole life
within a five-mile radius of where I was born. I would undoubtedly have
married a woman of my identical religious and socioeconomic
background. I would almost certainly have become a medical doctor, or an
engineer, or a computer programmer. I would have socialized
entirely within my ethic community. I would have a whole set of opinions
that could be predicted in advance; indeed, they would not
be very different from what my father believed, or his father before
him.
In sum, my destiny would to a large degree have been given
to me.

In America, I have seen my life take a radically different course.
In college I became interested in literature and politics,
and I resolved to make a career as a writer. I married a woman whose
ancestry is English, French, Scotch-Irish, German, and American
Indian. In my twenties I found myself working as a policy analyst in the
White House, even though I was not an American citizen. No
other country, I am sure, would have permitted a foreigner to work in
its
inner citadel of government.

In most countries in the world, your fate and your identity are
handed to you; in America, you determine them for yourself.
America is a country where you get to write the script of your own life.
Your life is like a blank sheet of paper, and you are the
artist. This notion of being the architect of your own destiny is the
incredibly powerful idea that is behind the worldwide appeal
of America. Young people especially find irresistible the prospect of
authoring the narrative of their own lives.

America has gone further than any other society in establishing
equality of rights.: There is nothing distinctively American
about slavery or bigotry. Slavery has existed in virtually every
culture,
and xenophobia, prejudice, and discrimination are
worldwide phenomena. Western civilization is the only civilization to
mount a principled campaign against slavery; no country
expended more treasure and blood to get rid of slavery than the United
States. While racism remains a problem in America, this
country has made strenuous efforts to eradicate discrimination, even to
the extent of enacting policies that give legal preference
in university admissions, jobs, and government contracts to members of
minority groups. Such policies remain controversial, but the
point is that it is extremely unlikely that a racist society would have
permitted such policies in the first place. And surely
African Americans like Jesse Jackson are vastly better off living in
America than they would be if they were to live in, say,
Ethiopia or Somalia.

America has found a solution to the problem of religious and
ethnic
conflict that continues to divide and terrorize much of
the world.: Visitors to places like New York are amazed to see the way
in
which Serbs and Croatians, Sikhs and Hindus, Irish
Catholics and Irish Protestants, Jews and Palestinians, all seem to work
and live together in harmony. How is this possible when
these same groups are spearing each other and burning each other's homes
in so many places in the world?

The American answer is twofold. First, separate the spheres of
religion and government so that no religion is given official
preference but all are free to practice their faith as they wish.
Second,
do not extend rights to racial or ethnic groups but only
to individuals; in this way, all are equal in the eyes of the law,
opportunity is open to anyone who can take advantage of it, and
everybody who embraces the American way of life can "become American."

Of course there are exceptions to these core principles, even in
America. Racial preferences are one such exception, which
explains why they are controversial. But in general America is the only
country in the world that extends full membership to
outsiders. The typical American could come to India, live for 40 years,
and take Indian citizenship. But he could not "become
Indian." He wouldn't see himself that way, nor would most Indians see
him
that way. In America, by contrast, hundreds of millions
have come from far-flung shores and over time they, or at least their
children, have in a profound and full sense "become American."

America has the kindest, gentlest foreign policy of any great
power
in world history.: Critics of the U.S. are likely to react
to this truth with sputtering outrage. They will point to longstanding
American support for a Latin or Middle Eastern despot, or the
unjust internment of the Japanese during World War II, or America's
reluctance to impose sanctions on South Africa's apartheid
regime. However one feels about these particular cases, let us concede
to
the critics the point that America is not always in the
right.

What the critics leave out is the other side of the ledger. Twice
in
the 20th century, the United States saved the world:
first from the Nazi threat, then from Soviet totalitarianism. What would
have been the world's fate if America had not existed?
After destroying Germany and Japan in World War II, the U.S. proceeded
to
rebuild both countries, and today they are American
allies. Now we are doing the same thing in Afghanistan and Iraq.
Consider,
too, how magnanimous the U.S. has been to the former
Soviet Union after its victory in the Cold War. For the most part
America
is an abstaining superpower: It shows no real interest in
conquering and subjugating the rest of the world. (Imagine how the
Soviets
would have acted if they had won the Cold War.) On
occasion the America intervenes to overthrow a tyrannical regime or to
halt massive human rights abuses in another country, but it
never stays to rule that country. In Grenada, Haiti, and Bosnia, the
U.S.
got in and then it got out. Moreover, when America does
get into a war, as in Iraq, its troops are supremely careful to avoid
targeting civilians and to minimize collateral damage. Even as
America bombed the Taliban infrastructure and hideouts, U.S. planes
dropped rations of food to avert hardship and starvation of
Afghan civilians. What other country does these things?

America, the freest nation on earth, is also the most virtuous
nation on earth.: This point seems counter-intuitive, given the
amount of conspicuous vulgarity, vice, and immorality in America. Indeed
some Islamic fundamentalists argue that their regimes are
morally superior to the United States because they seek to foster virtue
among the citizens. Virtue, these fundamentalists argue, is
a higher principle than liberty.

Indeed it is. And let us admit that in a free society, freedom
will
frequently be used badly. Freedom, by definition, includes
the freedom to do good or evil, to act nobly or basely. But if freedom
brings out the worst in people, it also brings out the best.
The millions of Americans who live decent, praiseworthy lives desire our
highest admiration because they have opted for the good
when the good is not the only available option. Even amidst the
temptations of a rich and free society, they have remained on the
straight path. Their virtue has special luster because it is freely
chosen.

By contrast, the societies that many Islamic fundamentalists seek
would eliminate the possibility of virtue. If the supply of
virtue is insufficient in a free society like America, it is almost
non-existent in an unfree society like Iran. The reason is that
coerced virtues are not virtues at all. Consider the woman who is
required
to wear a veil. There is no modesty in this, because she
is being compelled Compulsion cannot produce virtue, it can only produce
the outward semblance of virtue. Thus a free society like
America is not merely more prosperous, more varied, more peaceful, and
more tolerant - it is also morally superior to the theocratic
and authoritarian regimes that America's enemies advocate.

"To make us love our country," Edmund Burke once said, "our
country
ought to be lovely." Burke's point is that we should love
our country not just because it is ours, but also because it is good.
America is far from perfect, and there is lots of room for
improvement. In spite of its flaws, however, the American life as it is
lived today is the best life that our world has to offer.
Ultimately America is worthy of our love and sacrifice because, more
than
any other society, it makes possible the good life, and
the life that is good.

- Dinesh D'Souza's best-selling book What's So Great About America
has just been published in paperback by Penguin Books. He
is the Rishwain Fellow at the Hoover Institution at Stanford University.

What to love about the United States.
 

Housing prices have been dropping in Japan and Germany for the last ten
years.
New Jersey had a housing bust about ten years ago.
Los Angeles has had a recent housing bust.
In the US 1930-1940 had a housing bust.

On the long term average housing prices do rise. The question is, how long
are you willing to wait for return on investment? What is that return?

"SAIL LOCO" wrote in message
...
Watch the housing bubble burst

Yea people have been saying that forever. 50 years ago my father was
offered
the chance to buy ocean front property in Ocean City, Md for $100 an acre.
He
said someday they will be giving that away. As anyone can probably figure
out
that never happened.
S/V Express 30 "Ringmaster"
Trains are a winter sport

What to love about the United States.
 

I am so sick and tired of gloom and doomers.

Either lead, follow or get the **** out of the way, Gilligan!
For pity's sake but you sound like the typical liberal wimp.
Why is it that every generation feels they are the most important
generation? How come every generation predicts the end only
to have generations that follow engage in the same nonsense?
Whatever happened to the ability of a species to learn a thing
or two from past experience? Thousands upon thousands of
generations and humans are still around and still improving
their lot. How can this be?

Any man with half a brain would soon figure out that crying
like a bunch of babies, no matter how hard or how long, has
always failed to counteract the creativity of those who refuse
to forever stay in the womb; the creativity which, even if
embodied in the soul of one man in a million, is great enough
to negate the inferior, genetic, dead-end millions who whine,
caterwauler and fully intend to cast their personal failure to
work for a better future upon the entire body of humankind.

How inferior is an intellect that uses gloom and doom as a
method and then complains that things are not going his way?
How maladjusted is any individual who considers he even
HAS an intellect when he uses his paltry and defective gray
matter as a means to destroy that which he claims to wish
for. You whiners are so transparent and so self-defeating.
You make me sick with your constant complaining. If things
are so bad for you why not jump off a cliff or something and
end your miserable existence? At least allow those of us
who enjoy life to enjoy it in peace without having to smell
the stench of your self-centered negativism.

Gilligan, you disappoint me greatly. Just because your
failed libertarian ideas are proven to be failures you wish
failure to every other system of thought. This alone is
enough to prove your philosophy is as useless and impotent
as it has proven to be. A real man would recognize this
fact and get over it or shut up about it.

But, keep it up. Keep proclaiming your impotence
from the highest hilltop. You serve a purpose. You and
your like are good examples of a bad example. Those
of us who can see clearly need such reminders once
in a while of how NOT to act.


"Gilligan" wrote in message thlink.net...
What you have described here is America of the past.

Let's take a look at the futu

The law of the land, the US Constitution is becoming less and less relevant.

Spending under the Bush administrations first three years has gone up 13.5%.
The same time duration under Clinton only yielded an increase of 3.3%. Of
the five largest yearly increases in the federal budget in history, three
have occured under Bush. His legacy as governor of Texas confirms he is all
for big spending and big government. Less than 1/2 of Bush's spending was
for the military, the rest entitlements. He has saddled our future with big
government and the costs that go along with it.

Today, where is the opportunity? The only engineering and science jobs are
with the military-industrial complex. Even lawyers are unemployed. Health
insurance costs have gone up 30% in the last year for many companies. Look
at the costs businesses are saddled with due to government legislation.
Health care, social security, unemployment, OSHA, etc, etc. That's why many
jobs are going overseas, it simply costs too much to hire someone here. It's
the overhead, not the wage.

Why hasn't the economy pulled out of the recession? After all, people
trained in economics have been predicting a pullout for years now. Watch the
housing bubble burst. All those people with jobs in the trades will be
unemployed. People who have overmortgaged their houses will be paying on
loans worth nothing. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are on real shaky ground. If
low interest rates spur the economy, and we have the lowest rates since
1958, why isn't the economy booming? Why is there no risk taking in the
economy?

America is loosing good paying jobs rapidly. It's common to hear of someone
who three years ago was a physicist working on some new amazing technology
making 100K a year, now driving a delivery truck for $12.50 an hour. The
creative edge of our economy is no longer valued. The only job opportunities
that exist are in services, which are low paying and create no wealth.

The Republicans were our last stand against big, expensive and encroaching
government. They have let us down. We were swindled.

Tax cuts? What good are they when other costs go up because of government?

The best thing one can do is pack up your sailboat and go to a country where
it costs less to live. Have your stipend checks mailed to you and only come
back for health care. If you don't get checks from the government to live
on, or don't have the government paying your health care or don't have the
government as an employer, then you are hosed. Get a job in the underground
economy, because your PhD means nothing when you are pushing a mower. If you
push the mower legitimately you'll need licenses, permits, compliance
certificates, an accountant, a lawyer, etc. A ten dollar lawn job now must
support 40 dollars in government overhead - if you let it.

If you love America, read and know the Constitution. Look at what our
government has become. Is this what the Constitution intended?

If you want to see our economic future, look to Europe. In the past America
has pulled out of economic slumps. But no administration in peacetime
history has grown the Leviathen as the current administration, supposed
defenders of liberty. Next election get out and vote. Vote for gridlock,
it's our only hope until another Goldwater or Reagan comes along.

Gilligan







"jlrogers" wrote in message
.. .
America provides an amazingly good life for the ordinary guy.: Rich
people live well everywhere. But what distinguishes
America is that it provides an impressively high standard of living for
the "common man." We now live in a country where
construction workers regularly pay $4 for a nonfat latte, where maids
drive nice cars, and where plumbers take their families on
vacation to Europe.

Indeed newcomers to the United States are struck by the amenities
enjoyed by "poor" people in the United States. This fact was
dramatized in the 1980s when CBS television broadcast a documentary,
People Like Us, which was intended to show the miseries of the
poor during an ongoing recession. The Soviet Union also broadcast the
documentary, with a view to embarrassing the Reagan
administration. But by the testimony of former Soviet leaders, it had the
opposite effect. Ordinary people across the Soviet Union
saw that the poorest Americans have TV sets, microwave ovens, and cars.
They arrived at the same perception that I witnessed in an
acquaintance of mine from Bombay who has been unsuccessfully trying to
move to the United States. I asked him, "Why are you so eager
to come to America?" He replied, "I really want to live in a country where
the poor people are fat."

America offers more opportunity and social mobility than any other
country, including the countries of Europe: America is the
only country that has created a population of "self-made tycoons." Only in
America could Pierre Omidyar, whose parents are Iranian
and who grew up in Paris, have started a company like eBay. Only in
America could Vinod Khosla, the son of an Indian army officer,
become a leading venture capitalist, the shaper of the technology
industry, and a billionaire to boot. Admittedly tycoons are not
typical, but no country has created a better ladder than America for
people to ascend from modest circumstances to success.

Work and trade are respectable in America, which is not true
elsewhe Historically most cultures have despised the merchant
and the laborer, regarding the former as vile and corrupt and the latter
as degraded and vulgar. Some cultures, such as that of
ancient Greece and medieval Islam, even held that it is better to acquire
things through plunder than through trade or contract
labor. But the American founders altered this moral hierarchy. They
established a society in which the life of the businessman, and
of the people who worked for him, would be a noble calling. In the
American view, there is nothing vile or degraded about serving
your customers either as a CEO or as a waiter. The ordinary life of
production and supporting a family is more highly valued in the
United States than in any other country. Indeed America is the only
country in the world where we call the waiter "sir," as if he
were a knight.

America has achieved greater social equality than any other
society.: True, there are large inequalities of income and wealth
in America. In purely economic terms, Europe is more egalitarian. But
Americans are socially more equal than any other people, and
this is unaffected by economic disparities. Tocqueville noticed this
egalitarianism a century and a half ago, but it is if anything
more prevalent today. For all his riches, Bill Gates could not approach
the typical American and say, "Here's a $100 bill. I'll give
it to you if you kiss my feet." Most likely the person would tell Gates to
go to hell! The American view is that the rich guy may
have more money, but he isn't in any fundamental sense better than anyone
else.

People live longer, fuller lives in America.: Although protesters
rail against the American version of technological
capitalism at trade meetings around the world, in reality the American
system has given citizens many more years of life, and the
means to live more intensely and actively. In 1900, the life expectancy in
America was around 50 years; today, it is more than 75
years. Advances in medicine and agriculture are mainly responsible for the
change. This extension of the life-span means more years
to enjoy life, more free time to devote to a good cause, and more
occasions to do things with the grandchildren. In many countries,
people who are old seem to have nothing to do: They just wait to die. In
America the old are incredibly vigorous, and people in
their seventies pursue the pleasures of life, including remarriage and
sexual gratification, with a zeal that I find unnerving.

In America the destiny of the young is not given to them but created
by them.: Not long ago, I asked myself, "What would my
life have been like if I had never come to the United States?" If I had
remained in India, I would probably have lived my whole life
within a five-mile radius of where I was born. I would undoubtedly have
married a woman of my identical religious and socioeconomic
background. I would almost certainly have become a medical doctor, or an
engineer, or a computer programmer. I would have socialized
entirely within my ethic community. I would have a whole set of opinions
that could be predicted in advance; indeed, they would not
be very different from what my father believed, or his father before him.
In sum, my destiny would to a large degree have been given
to me.

In America, I have seen my life take a radically different course.
In college I became interested in literature and politics,
and I resolved to make a career as a writer. I married a woman whose
ancestry is English, French, Scotch-Irish, German, and American
Indian. In my twenties I found myself working as a policy analyst in the
White House, even though I was not an American citizen. No
other country, I am sure, would have permitted a foreigner to work in its
inner citadel of government.

In most countries in the world, your fate and your identity are
handed to you; in America, you determine them for yourself.
America is a country where you get to write the script of your own life.
Your life is like a blank sheet of paper, and you are the
artist. This notion of being the architect of your own destiny is the
incredibly powerful idea that is behind the worldwide appeal
of America. Young people especially find irresistible the prospect of
authoring the narrative of their own lives.

America has gone further than any other society in establishing
equality of rights.: There is nothing distinctively American
about slavery or bigotry. Slavery has existed in virtually every culture,
and xenophobia, prejudice, and discrimination are
worldwide phenomena. Western civilization is the only civilization to
mount a principled campaign against slavery; no country
expended more treasure and blood to get rid of slavery than the United
States. While racism remains a problem in America, this
country has made strenuous efforts to eradicate discrimination, even to
the extent of enacting policies that give legal preference
in university admissions, jobs, and government contracts to members of
minority groups. Such policies remain controversial, but the
point is that it is extremely unlikely that a racist society would have
permitted such policies in the first place. And surely
African Americans like Jesse Jackson are vastly better off living in
America than they would be if they were to live in, say,
Ethiopia or Somalia.

America has found a solution to the problem of religious and ethnic
conflict that continues to divide and terrorize much of
the world.: Visitors to places like New York are amazed to see the way in
which Serbs and Croatians, Sikhs and Hindus, Irish
Catholics and Irish Protestants, Jews and Palestinians, all seem to work
and live together in harmony. How is this possible when
these same groups are spearing each other and burning each other's homes
in so many places in the world?

The American answer is twofold. First, separate the spheres of
religion and government so that no religion is given official
preference but all are free to practice their faith as they wish. Second,
do not extend rights to racial or ethnic groups but only
to individuals; in this way, all are equal in the eyes of the law,
opportunity is open to anyone who can take advantage of it, and
everybody who embraces the American way of life can "become American."

Of course there are exceptions to these core principles, even in
America. Racial preferences are one such exception, which
explains why they are controversial. But in general America is the only
country in the world that extends full membership to
outsiders. The typical American could come to India, live for 40 years,
and take Indian citizenship. But he could not "become
Indian." He wouldn't see himself that way, nor would most Indians see him
that way. In America, by contrast, hundreds of millions
have come from far-flung shores and over time they, or at least their
children, have in a profound and full sense "become American."

America has the kindest, gentlest foreign policy of any great power
in world history.: Critics of the U.S. are likely to react
to this truth with sputtering outrage. They will point to longstanding
American support for a Latin or Middle Eastern despot, or the
unjust internment of the Japanese during World War II, or America's
reluctance to impose sanctions on South Africa's apartheid
regime. However one feels about these particular cases, let us concede to
the critics the point that America is not always in the
right.

What the critics leave out is the other side of the ledger. Twice in
the 20th century, the United States saved the world:
first from the Nazi threat, then from Soviet totalitarianism. What would
have been the world's fate if America had not existed?
After destroying Germany and Japan in World War II, the U.S. proceeded to
rebuild both countries, and today they are American
allies. Now we are doing the same thing in Afghanistan and Iraq. Consider,
too, how magnanimous the U.S. has been to the former
Soviet Union after its victory in the Cold War. For the most part America
is an abstaining superpower: It shows no real interest in
conquering and subjugating the rest of the world. (Imagine how the Soviets
would have acted if they had won the Cold War.) On
occasion the America intervenes to overthrow a tyrannical regime or to
halt massive human rights abuses in another country, but it
never stays to rule that country. In Grenada, Haiti, and Bosnia, the U.S.
got in and then it got out. Moreover, when America does
get into a war, as in Iraq, its troops are supremely careful to avoid
targeting civilians and to minimize collateral damage. Even as
America bombed the Taliban infrastructure and hideouts, U.S. planes
dropped rations of food to avert hardship and starvation of
Afghan civilians. What other country does these things?

America, the freest nation on earth, is also the most virtuous
nation on earth.: This point seems counter-intuitive, given the
amount of conspicuous vulgarity, vice, and immorality in America. Indeed
some Islamic fundamentalists argue that their regimes are
morally superior to the United States because they seek to foster virtue
among the citizens. Virtue, these fundamentalists argue, is
a higher principle than liberty.

Indeed it is. And let us admit that in a free society, freedom will
frequently be used badly. Freedom, by definition, includes
the freedom to do good or evil, to act nobly or basely. But if freedom
brings out the worst in people, it also brings out the best.
The millions of Americans who live decent, praiseworthy lives desire our
highest admiration because they have opted for the good
when the good is not the only available option. Even amidst the
temptations of a rich and free society, they have remained on the
straight path. Their virtue has special luster because it is freely
chosen.

By contrast, the societies that many Islamic fundamentalists seek
would eliminate the possibility of virtue. If the supply of
virtue is insufficient in a free society like America, it is almost
non-existent in an unfree society like Iran. The reason is that
coerced virtues are not virtues at all. Consider the woman who is required
to wear a veil. There is no modesty in this, because she
is being compelled Compulsion cannot produce virtue, it can only produce
the outward semblance of virtue. Thus a free society like
America is not merely more prosperous, more varied, more peaceful, and
more tolerant - it is also morally superior to the theocratic
and authoritarian regimes that America's enemies advocate.

"To make us love our country," Edmund Burke once said, "our country
ought to be lovely." Burke's point is that we should love
our country not just because it is ours, but also because it is good.
America is far from perfect, and there is lots of room for
improvement. In spite of its flaws, however, the American life as it is
lived today is the best life that our world has to offer.
Ultimately America is worthy of our love and sacrifice because, more than
any other society, it makes possible the good life, and
the life that is good.

- Dinesh D'Souza's best-selling book What's So Great About America
has just been published in paperback by Penguin Books. He
is the Rishwain Fellow at the Hoover Institution at Stanford University.

What to love about the United States.
 

Do you buy your crack from Moroon?


"Gilligan" wrote in message thlink.net...
What you have described here is America of the past.

Let's take a look at the futu

The law of the land, the US Constitution is becoming less and less relevant.

Spending under the Bush administrations first three years has gone up 13.5%.
The same time duration under Clinton only yielded an increase of 3.3%. Of
the five largest yearly increases in the federal budget in history, three
have occured under Bush. His legacy as governor of Texas confirms he is all
for big spending and big government. Less than 1/2 of Bush's spending was
for the military, the rest entitlements. He has saddled our future with big
government and the costs that go along with it.

Today, where is the opportunity? The only engineering and science jobs are
with the military-industrial complex. Even lawyers are unemployed. Health
insurance costs have gone up 30% in the last year for many companies. Look
at the costs businesses are saddled with due to government legislation.
Health care, social security, unemployment, OSHA, etc, etc. That's why many
jobs are going overseas, it simply costs too much to hire someone here. It's
the overhead, not the wage.

Why hasn't the economy pulled out of the recession? After all, people
trained in economics have been predicting a pullout for years now. Watch the
housing bubble burst. All those people with jobs in the trades will be
unemployed. People who have overmortgaged their houses will be paying on
loans worth nothing. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are on real shaky ground. If
low interest rates spur the economy, and we have the lowest rates since
1958, why isn't the economy booming? Why is there no risk taking in the
economy?

America is loosing good paying jobs rapidly. It's common to hear of someone
who three years ago was a physicist working on some new amazing technology
making 100K a year, now driving a delivery truck for $12.50 an hour. The
creative edge of our economy is no longer valued. The only job opportunities
that exist are in services, which are low paying and create no wealth.

The Republicans were our last stand against big, expensive and encroaching
government. They have let us down. We were swindled.

Tax cuts? What good are they when other costs go up because of government?

The best thing one can do is pack up your sailboat and go to a country where
it costs less to live. Have your stipend checks mailed to you and only come
back for health care. If you don't get checks from the government to live
on, or don't have the government paying your health care or don't have the
government as an employer, then you are hosed. Get a job in the underground
economy, because your PhD means nothing when you are pushing a mower. If you
push the mower legitimately you'll need licenses, permits, compliance
certificates, an accountant, a lawyer, etc. A ten dollar lawn job now must
support 40 dollars in government overhead - if you let it.

If you love America, read and know the Constitution. Look at what our
government has become. Is this what the Constitution intended?

If you want to see our economic future, look to Europe. In the past America
has pulled out of economic slumps. But no administration in peacetime
history has grown the Leviathen as the current administration, supposed
defenders of liberty. Next election get out and vote. Vote for gridlock,
it's our only hope until another Goldwater or Reagan comes along.

Gilligan







"jlrogers" wrote in message
.. .
America provides an amazingly good life for the ordinary guy.: Rich
people live well everywhere. But what distinguishes
America is that it provides an impressively high standard of living for
the "common man." We now live in a country where
construction workers regularly pay $4 for a nonfat latte, where maids
drive nice cars, and where plumbers take their families on
vacation to Europe.

Indeed newcomers to the United States are struck by the amenities
enjoyed by "poor" people in the United States. This fact was
dramatized in the 1980s when CBS television broadcast a documentary,
People Like Us, which was intended to show the miseries of the
poor during an ongoing recession. The Soviet Union also broadcast the
documentary, with a view to embarrassing the Reagan
administration. But by the testimony of former Soviet leaders, it had the
opposite effect. Ordinary people across the Soviet Union
saw that the poorest Americans have TV sets, microwave ovens, and cars.
They arrived at the same perception that I witnessed in an
acquaintance of mine from Bombay who has been unsuccessfully trying to
move to the United States. I asked him, "Why are you so eager
to come to America?" He replied, "I really want to live in a country where
the poor people are fat."

America offers more opportunity and social mobility than any other
country, including the countries of Europe: America is the
only country that has created a population of "self-made tycoons." Only in
America could Pierre Omidyar, whose parents are Iranian
and who grew up in Paris, have started a company like eBay. Only in
America could Vinod Khosla, the son of an Indian army officer,
become a leading venture capitalist, the shaper of the technology
industry, and a billionaire to boot. Admittedly tycoons are not
typical, but no country has created a better ladder than America for
people to ascend from modest circumstances to success.

Work and trade are respectable in America, which is not true
elsewhe Historically most cultures have despised the merchant
and the laborer, regarding the former as vile and corrupt and the latter
as degraded and vulgar. Some cultures, such as that of
ancient Greece and medieval Islam, even held that it is better to acquire
things through plunder than through trade or contract
labor. But the American founders altered this moral hierarchy. They
established a society in which the life of the businessman, and
of the people who worked for him, would be a noble calling. In the
American view, there is nothing vile or degraded about serving
your customers either as a CEO or as a waiter. The ordinary life of
production and supporting a family is more highly valued in the
United States than in any other country. Indeed America is the only
country in the world where we call the waiter "sir," as if he
were a knight.

America has achieved greater social equality than any other
society.: True, there are large inequalities of income and wealth
in America. In purely economic terms, Europe is more egalitarian. But
Americans are socially more equal than any other people, and
this is unaffected by economic disparities. Tocqueville noticed this
egalitarianism a century and a half ago, but it is if anything
more prevalent today. For all his riches, Bill Gates could not approach
the typical American and say, "Here's a $100 bill. I'll give
it to you if you kiss my feet." Most likely the person would tell Gates to
go to hell! The American view is that the rich guy may
have more money, but he isn't in any fundamental sense better than anyone
else.

People live longer, fuller lives in America.: Although protesters
rail against the American version of technological
capitalism at trade meetings around the world, in reality the American
system has given citizens many more years of life, and the
means to live more intensely and actively. In 1900, the life expectancy in
America was around 50 years; today, it is more than 75
years. Advances in medicine and agriculture are mainly responsible for the
change. This extension of the life-span means more years
to enjoy life, more free time to devote to a good cause, and more
occasions to do things with the grandchildren. In many countries,
people who are old seem to have nothing to do: They just wait to die. In
America the old are incredibly vigorous, and people in
their seventies pursue the pleasures of life, including remarriage and
sexual gratification, with a zeal that I find unnerving.

In America the destiny of the young is not given to them but created
by them.: Not long ago, I asked myself, "What would my
life have been like if I had never come to the United States?" If I had
remained in India, I would probably have lived my whole life
within a five-mile radius of where I was born. I would undoubtedly have
married a woman of my identical religious and socioeconomic
background. I would almost certainly have become a medical doctor, or an
engineer, or a computer programmer. I would have socialized
entirely within my ethic community. I would have a whole set of opinions
that could be predicted in advance; indeed, they would not
be very different from what my father believed, or his father before him.
In sum, my destiny would to a large degree have been given
to me.

In America, I have seen my life take a radically different course.
In college I became interested in literature and politics,
and I resolved to make a career as a writer. I married a woman whose
ancestry is English, French, Scotch-Irish, German, and American
Indian. In my twenties I found myself working as a policy analyst in the
White House, even though I was not an American citizen. No
other country, I am sure, would have permitted a foreigner to work in its
inner citadel of government.

In most countries in the world, your fate and your identity are
handed to you; in America, you determine them for yourself.
America is a country where you get to write the script of your own life.
Your life is like a blank sheet of paper, and you are the
artist. This notion of being the architect of your own destiny is the
incredibly powerful idea that is behind the worldwide appeal
of America. Young people especially find irresistible the prospect of
authoring the narrative of their own lives.

America has gone further than any other society in establishing
equality of rights.: There is nothing distinctively American
about slavery or bigotry. Slavery has existed in virtually every culture,
and xenophobia, prejudice, and discrimination are
worldwide phenomena. Western civilization is the only civilization to
mount a principled campaign against slavery; no country
expended more treasure and blood to get rid of slavery than the United
States. While racism remains a problem in America, this
country has made strenuous efforts to eradicate discrimination, even to
the extent of enacting policies that give legal preference
in university admissions, jobs, and government contracts to members of
minority groups. Such policies remain controversial, but the
point is that it is extremely unlikely that a racist society would have
permitted such policies in the first place. And surely
African Americans like Jesse Jackson are vastly better off living in
America than they would be if they were to live in, say,
Ethiopia or Somalia.

America has found a solution to the problem of religious and ethnic
conflict that continues to divide and terrorize much of
the world.: Visitors to places like New York are amazed to see the way in
which Serbs and Croatians, Sikhs and Hindus, Irish
Catholics and Irish Protestants, Jews and Palestinians, all seem to work
and live together in harmony. How is this possible when
these same groups are spearing each other and burning each other's homes
in so many places in the world?

The American answer is twofold. First, separate the spheres of
religion and government so that no religion is given official
preference but all are free to practice their faith as they wish. Second,
do not extend rights to racial or ethnic groups but only
to individuals; in this way, all are equal in the eyes of the law,
opportunity is open to anyone who can take advantage of it, and
everybody who embraces the American way of life can "become American."

Of course there are exceptions to these core principles, even in
America. Racial preferences are one such exception, which
explains why they are controversial. But in general America is the only
country in the world that extends full membership to
outsiders. The typical American could come to India, live for 40 years,
and take Indian citizenship. But he could not "become
Indian." He wouldn't see himself that way, nor would most Indians see him
that way. In America, by contrast, hundreds of millions
have come from far-flung shores and over time they, or at least their
children, have in a profound and full sense "become American."

America has the kindest, gentlest foreign policy of any great power
in world history.: Critics of the U.S. are likely to react
to this truth with sputtering outrage. They will point to longstanding
American support for a Latin or Middle Eastern despot, or the
unjust internment of the Japanese during World War II, or America's
reluctance to impose sanctions on South Africa's apartheid
regime. However one feels about these particular cases, let us concede to
the critics the point that America is not always in the
right.

What the critics leave out is the other side of the ledger. Twice in
the 20th century, the United States saved the world:
first from the Nazi threat, then from Soviet totalitarianism. What would
have been the world's fate if America had not existed?
After destroying Germany and Japan in World War II, the U.S. proceeded to
rebuild both countries, and today they are American
allies. Now we are doing the same thing in Afghanistan and Iraq. Consider,
too, how magnanimous the U.S. has been to the former
Soviet Union after its victory in the Cold War. For the most part America
is an abstaining superpower: It shows no real interest in
conquering and subjugating the rest of the world. (Imagine how the Soviets
would have acted if they had won the Cold War.) On
occasion the America intervenes to overthrow a tyrannical regime or to
halt massive human rights abuses in another country, but it
never stays to rule that country. In Grenada, Haiti, and Bosnia, the U.S.
got in and then it got out. Moreover, when America does
get into a war, as in Iraq, its troops are supremely careful to avoid
targeting civilians and to minimize collateral damage. Even as
America bombed the Taliban infrastructure and hideouts, U.S. planes
dropped rations of food to avert hardship and starvation of
Afghan civilians. What other country does these things?

America, the freest nation on earth, is also the most virtuous
nation on earth.: This point seems counter-intuitive, given the
amount of conspicuous vulgarity, vice, and immorality in America. Indeed
some Islamic fundamentalists argue that their regimes are
morally superior to the United States because they seek to foster virtue
among the citizens. Virtue, these fundamentalists argue, is
a higher principle than liberty.

Indeed it is. And let us admit that in a free society, freedom will
frequently be used badly. Freedom, by definition, includes
the freedom to do good or evil, to act nobly or basely. But if freedom
brings out the worst in people, it also brings out the best.
The millions of Americans who live decent, praiseworthy lives desire our
highest admiration because they have opted for the good
when the good is not the only available option. Even amidst the
temptations of a rich and free society, they have remained on the
straight path. Their virtue has special luster because it is freely
chosen.

By contrast, the societies that many Islamic fundamentalists seek
would eliminate the possibility of virtue. If the supply of
virtue is insufficient in a free society like America, it is almost
non-existent in an unfree society like Iran. The reason is that
coerced virtues are not virtues at all. Consider the woman who is required
to wear a veil. There is no modesty in this, because she
is being compelled Compulsion cannot produce virtue, it can only produce
the outward semblance of virtue. Thus a free society like
America is not merely more prosperous, more varied, more peaceful, and
more tolerant — it is also morally superior to the theocratic
and authoritarian regimes that America's enemies advocate.

"To make us love our country," Edmund Burke once said, "our country
ought to be lovely." Burke's point is that we should love
our country not just because it is ours, but also because it is good.
America is far from perfect, and there is lots of room for
improvement. In spite of its flaws, however, the American life as it is
lived today is the best life that our world has to offer.
Ultimately America is worthy of our love and sacrifice because, more than
any other society, it makes possible the good life, and
the life that is good.

— Dinesh D'Souza's best-selling book What's So Great About America
has just been published in paperback by Penguin Books. He
is the Rishwain Fellow at the Hoover Institution at Stanford University.

What to love about the United States.
 

I've seen you miss the point before, but this time you missed it while simultaneously surrounding it with your ass. It must 'ave
slipped 'tween your cheeks and tickled your splinter.


"Scout" wrote in message ...
I've heard Dinesh D'Souza speak, and I like most of what he says. However,
when he speaks of plumbers and waiters and other such workers, and is in awe
that they have some cash and some rights, he also needs to know that it was
plumbers and waiters construction workers who fought, suffered, and often
died to make America what it is today.

We now live in a country where construction workers regularly pay $4 for a
nonfat latte
where maids drive nice cars, and where plumbers take their families on
vacation to Europe.
- Which is how it should be.

"I really want to live in a country where the poor people are fat."
- this is true

no country has created a better ladder than America for people to ascend
from modest circumstances to success.
- this is true

Work and trade are respectable in America
- They deserve respect, but America still looks down on the tradespeople,
big mistake. This is not true in some other places, like Germany, where the
trades are honored. In America, we send our academically failing students,
behavior problems, malcontents, and social misfits to the Vocational high
schools to learn a trade. It is only the trade unions who are seeing
through this farce, and they recruit new members not from vocational high
schools, but from colleges. Trade Union members are told to not send their
children to vocational high schools. How sad this is that the educational
systems has *******ized an ancient and proven system of apprenticing.

In the American view, there is nothing vile or degraded about serving your
customers either as a CEO or as a waiter.
- Unfortunately, neither is likely to get good service. Try dealing with the
IRS, any insurance agency, any governmental agency, any business with more
than 50 employees. Good luck.

Indeed America is the only country in the world where we call the waiter
"sir," as if he were a knight.
- I was a waiter when I was a young college student, so I can't agree with
this one. People, especially our visiting neighbors from New York, treated
us like ****. Then they typically stiffed us for a tip. Meanwhile, food
workers make less than minimum wage.


For all his riches, Bill Gates could not approach the typical American
and say, "Here's a $100 bill. I'll give
it to you if you kiss my feet." Most likely the person would tell Gates
to go to hell!
- He should visit Times Square, people are doing a lot more than kiss feet
for a lot less money.

Scout

What to love about the United States.
 

My splinter? hahaha!
Oh Please! Maybe I should just copy and paste someone else's opinion and
call it my own. As you do, for example. Your MO seems to consist mainly of
piggy-backing on what others are saying. This is America pal, surely you
can afford your own thoughts. I've read your work too, and no offense, but I
don't think I'll be worrying about your opinion anytime soon.
Ironically, I agreed with many of D'Souza's points. Still, you are saying I
must agree with everything he says, or risk your reprisals? Are you one of
those folks who cannot even be agreed with? Well, such is life (at least, in
America).
Scout


"jlrogers" wrote
I've seen you miss the point before, but this time you missed it while
simultaneously surrounding it with your ass. It must 'ave
slipped 'tween your cheeks and tickled your splinter.


"Scout" wrote in message
...
I've heard Dinesh D'Souza speak, and I like most of what he says.
However,
when he speaks of plumbers and waiters and other such workers, and is in
awe
that they have some cash and some rights, he also needs to know that it
was
plumbers and waiters construction workers who fought, suffered, and
often
died to make America what it is today.

We now live in a country where construction workers regularly pay $4
for a
nonfat latte
where maids drive nice cars, and where plumbers take their families on
vacation to Europe.
- Which is how it should be.

"I really want to live in a country where the poor people are fat."
- this is true

no country has created a better ladder than America for people to
ascend
from modest circumstances to success.
- this is true

Work and trade are respectable in America
- They deserve respect, but America still looks down on the
tradespeople,
big mistake. This is not true in some other places, like Germany, where
the
trades are honored. In America, we send our academically failing
students,
behavior problems, malcontents, and social misfits to the Vocational
high
schools to learn a trade. It is only the trade unions who are seeing
through this farce, and they recruit new members not from vocational
high
schools, but from colleges. Trade Union members are told to not send
their
children to vocational high schools. How sad this is that the
educational
systems has *******ized an ancient and proven system of apprenticing.

In the American view, there is nothing vile or degraded about serving
your
customers either as a CEO or as a waiter.
- Unfortunately, neither is likely to get good service. Try dealing with
the
IRS, any insurance agency, any governmental agency, any business with
more
than 50 employees. Good luck.

Indeed America is the only country in the world where we call the
waiter
"sir," as if he were a knight.
- I was a waiter when I was a young college student, so I can't agree
with
this one. People, especially our visiting neighbors from New York,
treated
us like ****. Then they typically stiffed us for a tip. Meanwhile, food
workers make less than minimum wage.


For all his riches, Bill Gates could not approach the typical
American
and say, "Here's a $100 bill. I'll give
it to you if you kiss my feet." Most likely the person would tell
Gates
to go to hell!
- He should visit Times Square, people are doing a lot more than kiss
feet
for a lot less money.

Scout

What to love about the United States.
 

Touché, oh sphincter breath. However, agreement, or disagreement, is moot when the point is missed. And you couldn't find a piano
in the bathroom.


"Scout" wrote in message ...
My splinter? hahaha!
Oh Please! Maybe I should just copy and paste someone else's opinion and
call it my own. As you do, for example. Your MO seems to consist mainly of
piggy-backing on what others are saying. This is America pal, surely you
can afford your own thoughts. I've read your work too, and no offense, but I
don't think I'll be worrying about your opinion anytime soon.
Ironically, I agreed with many of D'Souza's points. Still, you are saying I
must agree with everything he says, or risk your reprisals? Are you one of
those folks who cannot even be agreed with? Well, such is life (at least, in
America).
Scout


"jlrogers" wrote
I've seen you miss the point before, but this time you missed it while
simultaneously surrounding it with your ass. It must 'ave
slipped 'tween your cheeks and tickled your splinter.


"Scout" wrote in message
...
I've heard Dinesh D'Souza speak, and I like most of what he says.
However,
when he speaks of plumbers and waiters and other such workers, and is in
awe
that they have some cash and some rights, he also needs to know that it
was
plumbers and waiters construction workers who fought, suffered, and
often
died to make America what it is today.

We now live in a country where construction workers regularly pay $4
for a
nonfat latte
where maids drive nice cars, and where plumbers take their families on
vacation to Europe.
- Which is how it should be.

"I really want to live in a country where the poor people are fat."
- this is true

no country has created a better ladder than America for people to
ascend
from modest circumstances to success.
- this is true

Work and trade are respectable in America
- They deserve respect, but America still looks down on the
tradespeople,
big mistake. This is not true in some other places, like Germany, where
the
trades are honored. In America, we send our academically failing
students,
behavior problems, malcontents, and social misfits to the Vocational
high
schools to learn a trade. It is only the trade unions who are seeing
through this farce, and they recruit new members not from vocational
high
schools, but from colleges. Trade Union members are told to not send
their
children to vocational high schools. How sad this is that the
educational
systems has *******ized an ancient and proven system of apprenticing.

In the American view, there is nothing vile or degraded about serving
your
customers either as a CEO or as a waiter.
- Unfortunately, neither is likely to get good service. Try dealing with
the
IRS, any insurance agency, any governmental agency, any business with
more
than 50 employees. Good luck.

Indeed America is the only country in the world where we call the
waiter
"sir," as if he were a knight.
- I was a waiter when I was a young college student, so I can't agree
with
this one. People, especially our visiting neighbors from New York,
treated
us like ****. Then they typically stiffed us for a tip. Meanwhile, food
workers make less than minimum wage.


For all his riches, Bill Gates could not approach the typical
American
and say, "Here's a $100 bill. I'll give
it to you if you kiss my feet." Most likely the person would tell
Gates
to go to hell!
- He should visit Times Square, people are doing a lot more than kiss
feet
for a lot less money.

Scout

What to love about the United States.
 

How would you know if I missed the point, or for that matter what the point
really is? And btw, when you throw something out there, particularly
something you didn't even bother to write yourself, then just be quiet, be
patient, and listen to what comes back. Ever fancy that an American might
have some legitimate feelings, based on personal experiences, about what it
means to labor, sacrifice, and live in America? Or do you suppose that only
Indians are experts on Americans?
Had you paused to cogitate, you might have considered the fact that I have
heard D'Souza speak at length, and might have formulated a different take on
his perspective than you gleaned from the blurb you pasted in here. And I'm
not even disagreeing with his thesis for God's sake!
So listen up Admiral Splinter, I think you can be saved in spite of your
narrow views and rude ways, but you must read this quotation aloud, or
nothing good can come of this. Ok? Ready?
"From now on, the point is whatever Scout says it is!"
Did you say it? Yes? Good Boy!
Scout
p.s. It shouldn't surprise anyone that you'd keep a piano in the bathroom,
it would explain the splinters in your sphincter. A fluffy cover would make
a nifty stool softener.
Touché Douché



"jlrogers" wrote in message
. ..
Touché, oh sphincter breath. However, agreement, or disagreement, is moot
when the point is missed. And you couldn't find a piano
in the bathroom.


"Scout" wrote in message
...
My splinter? hahaha!
Oh Please! Maybe I should just copy and paste someone else's opinion and

What to love about the United States.
 

and where plumbers take their families on
vacation to Europe.

Our plumber lives in a 250K house and has a cottage on the lake and still takes extravagant vacations. Our electrician has an
even more expensive house, a second house on the lake and a 30 foot motor boat.
--
katysails
s/v Chanteuse
Kirie Elite 32
Ad eundum quo nemo ante iit.
http://katysails.tripod.com

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax
and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein

What to love about the United States.
 

On Sun, 06 Jul 2003 15:18:04 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

What you have described here is America of the past.

Let's take a look at the futu

The law of the land, the US Constitution is becoming less and less relevant.

Spending under the Bush administrations first three years has gone up 13.5%.
The same time duration under Clinton only yielded an increase of 3.3%.

Bull****.

[all other bull**** deleted]




Ave Imperator Bush!
Bush Was Right! Four More Beers!

What to love about the United States.
 

On Sun, 06 Jul 2003 17:04:27 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

Housing prices have been dropping in Japan and Germany for the last ten
years.

Where the hell did you hear that?

The Japanese bought Rockefeller Center in NYC because property values
were rising so fast they couldn't buy investment property in Tokyo.
They thought property in NYC would be a good investment.




Ave Imperator Bush!
Bush Was Right! Four More Beers!

What to love about the United States.
 

On Sun, 6 Jul 2003 16:28:26 -0400, "katysails"
wrote this crap:


and where plumbers take their families on
vacation to Europe.

Our plumber lives in a 250K house and has a cottage on the lake and still takes extravagant vacations. Our electrician has an
even more expensive house, a second house on the lake and a 30 foot motor boat.


I pity those people who have such small houses and small boats.




Ave Imperator Bush!
Bush Was Right! Four More Beers!

What to love about the United States.
 

Read it in The Economist about three issues ago.


"Horvath" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 06 Jul 2003 17:04:27 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

Housing prices have been dropping in Japan and Germany for the last ten
years.

Where the hell did you hear that?

The Japanese bought Rockefeller Center in NYC because property values
were rising so fast they couldn't buy investment property in Tokyo.
They thought property in NYC would be a good investment.




Ave Imperator Bush!
Bush Was Right! Four More Beers!

What to love about the United States.
 

2003 Budget Completes Big Jump in Spending


By Glenn Kessler
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, April 15, 2002; Page A01


The Bush administration is poised to complete the biggest increase in
government spending since the 1960s' "Great Society," the result of
conducting the war on terrorism while substantially boosting the education
and transportation budgets, according to a detailed analysis of government
spending patterns.

Spending on government programs will increase by 22 percent from 1999 to
2003 in inflation-adjusted dollars, according to the analysis by The
Washington Post and vetted by budget experts in both parties.

The president's 2003 budget proposals, combined with spending approved in
the first year of his administration and the last two years of the Clinton
administration, dwarf the spending increase from any four-year period since
President Lyndon Johnson fought the Vietnam War while launching a war on
poverty. Other periods of substantial increases in domestic spending,
including the Nixon and Carter administrations, were accompanied by cuts in
military spending. President Ronald Reagan boosted money for the mili- tary
while trimming the domestic budget.

In the short term, the latest spending hike is one factor helping to pull
the nation out of recession. But over the long run, some experts say, most
of the spending will be a drag on the economy, heighten the risk of
sustained budget deficits and limit the maneuvering room of policymakers
when, 10 years from now, the government must help fund the baby boomers'
health care and retirement needs.

"We should be very concerned," said John Cogan, a budget expert at the
Hoover Institution who advised the Bush campaign. "Clearly, the defense and
national security increases are warranted. The failure to offset those
increases with reductions should be a source of concern. The wrong thing to
do is not confront those choices."

President Bush has regularly warned against the perils of federal spending,
declaring last year that "excessive federal spending threatens economic
vitality." Although administration officials vow to control spending once
the current emergency has passed, many experts believe that will be
difficult, if not impossible. Last year's tax cut and the recent recession
may result in the first back-to-back years of falling revenue since the late
1950s.

Now, the military is slated to get the biggest increase in two decades,
matching the previous Bush administration's budget when adjusted for
inflation. Homeland security needs dominate the nonmilitary budget in 2003,
but nonmilitary spending had already risen dramatically in recent years as
the nation briefly enjoyed budget surpluses.

Measured another way, federal spending, minus interest costs on the debt,
will have grown by nearly 2 percentage points of the overall U.S. economy
from 1999 to 2003 -- from 16.6 percent to 18.5 percent.

The total for the 2003 budget likely will go higher as pressure builds in
Congress to add to the administration's budget requests in this election
year and to enact new benefits such as a prescription drug plan for Medicare
recipients. The calculations also do not include the effect of the
administration's recent $27 billion supplemental spending request for fiscal
2002.

Bush administration officials say that they tried to clamp down on
spending -- and intend to take a hard line in the future -- but that now
they are focusing on ensuring the safety of Americans. Spending on annually
funded programs, in inflation-adjusted dollars, rose about 9 percent in the
last two years of the Clinton administration and is scheduled to grow nearly
15 percent in the first two years of the Bush administration.

"This is an important phenomenon that needs to be closely watched," Office
of Management and Budget Director Mitchell E. Daniels Jr. said after
reviewing The Post research. "We cannot make the 'guns and butter' mistake"
of the 1960s, he said, referring to simultaneous spending hikes for military
and domestic items.

Daniels said he believed much of the homeland security spending would be
one-time expenses, such as building a vaccine stockpile, and thus would not
be built into future spending. He said the administration has tried to slow
the growth in other spending. For example, after approving last year a
substantial increase in education spending -- which has risen nearly 50
percent in inflation-adjusted dollars since 1999 -- the administration has
proposed essentially to freeze education spending until 2007.

The White House says that if homeland security and Sept. 11 emergency
spending is excluded, nondefense spending rose by 3.3 percent in 2002 and is
slated to decline by 0.4 percent in 2003. In a meeting with congressional
leaders last week, Bush vowed to veto spending bills that exceeded his
spending targets, a White House official said.

"If we are not prepared to roll back spending" once the current crisis is
over, Daniels said, "we will make a fundamental mistake."

That may be difficult. Robert Reischauer, president of the Urban Institute
and a former director of the Congressional Budget Office, noted that only
once during the 1990s, when the government struggled to get the deficit
under control, did the spending on annually funded domestic programs decline
after inflation is taken into account.

"Congress didn't really show a great ability to hold down nondefense
discretionary spending," Reischauer said.

Kevin Hassett, a budget expert at the conservative-leaning American
Enterprise Institute, said the emergence of budget surpluses led directly to
the spending growth. "It is really obvious that when there is money around,
they will spend it, even if they are Republicans," he said.

Hassett noted that the administration last year pushed for a tax cut by
arguing it would restrain spending. "They said it would starve the beast,"
he said. "But we have a hungry beast who is somehow finding food anyway. . .
.. You've got to wonder how fiscally conservative the Bush guys are. Granted,
you could say there are a lot of priorities. But shucks, couldn't we find
other things to cut?"

Peter Orszag, a former Clinton economic aide and now fellow at the liberal
Brookings Institution, said much of the spending growth could be attributed
to pent-up demands after a period of frugality.

"These are significant increases, but from very low levels," Orszag said.
"Discretionary spending as a share of the gross domestic product had fallen
to low levels. There were needs and demands that had been built up and
needed to be addressed."

Orszag said the revenue loss from the Bush tax cut in future years will
begin to dwarf the spending increases in the recent past.

Thomas Kahn, Democratic staff director of the House Budget Committee, noted
that the calculations do not include the huge defense buildup that the
administration plans beyond 2003.

"The story is even more troubling than these numbers suggest," he said.
"Republican rhetoric suggests they are fiscally tight. But they are big
spenders as long as it is on programs they want to spend money on."

Reischauer said that despite the recent emergence of deficits, the overall
fiscal picture is still bright, in part because the deficit this year will
be relatively small. "We are not in deep doo-doo by the standards of the
1980s and 1990s at all," he said.

But he added, "the pressures for additional spending are going to be very
strong. Institutionally, the restraints are crumbling. The political
environment is not auspicious" given the narrowly divided Congress.

"The administration doesn't want to lose the House, and it is mindful of the
fallout of any discipline they impose on their election chances," Reischauer
said. "They can talk the talk. Can they walk the walk?"


"Horvath" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 06 Jul 2003 15:18:04 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

What you have described here is America of the past.

Let's take a look at the futu

The law of the land, the US Constitution is becoming less and less
relevant.

Spending under the Bush administrations first three years has gone up
13.5%.
The same time duration under Clinton only yielded an increase of 3.3%.

Bull****.

[all other bull**** deleted]




Ave Imperator Bush!
Bush Was Right! Four More Beers!

What to love about the United States.
 

It's obvious which generation is the most important:


Government Budget Spending

Families have long been recognized as the basic foundation of every society.
Children have long been recognized our hope for the future. There is little
doubt that in today's society, families and our children are under extreme
pressure from many sources. Politicians coined the term "family values," but
most elected officials have ignored children's issues when they get to
Congress. Our federal government has failed miserably in promoting and
funding programs and ideals that strengthen the family. Just look at our
government's failed "War on Drugs, the Tax Code, our declining Educational
System, or the many liberal laws that have given us such things as abortion,
no-fault divorce, a ban on prayer in schools, widespread pornography,
violence on TV, state intrusion into family autonomy, etc. and the reasons
for this pressure becomes obvious.

For those GPs on that advocate GP "forced visitation" laws and use as their
argument their concern for the "best interests and welfare of the children",
here's your chance to help, your chance to put you money where your mouth
is.

A study of federal spending, using the U.S. Federal Budget reveals some
interesting facts. One glaring inequity that stands out is the fact that
while the government often gives lip service to their concern for our
children, they fail miserably when it comes to providing the funding and
programs necessary to help. As we all know, the Federal Government is quick
to tax and spend, but it is how the money is spent that is quite revealing.
The federal government currently spends more than five times more on
programs and entitlements for Americans over 65 than it spends on children,
even though there are twice as many children as elderly. If this isn't
shocking enough, how about this. The lion's share of this money spent on the
elderly is not even means tested. This means the money is just doled out
without verifying whether it is needed.

What's even more shocking is that organizations that purport to support our
children, are in fact partners in this injustice. Let's just look at one
such organization's (the NEA) legislative program agenda. In a study, John
Berthoud, Vice President of the Alexis de Toqueville Institution, revealed
that "If every item in the National Education Association's (NEA)
Legislative Program for the 104th Congress were enacted, federal spending
would increase by at least $702 billion annually." The study uses data on
legislative proposals compiled by the National Taxpayers Union Foundation in
their BillTally tracking system. The spending estimates for the different
proposals come from non-partisan sources such as the Congressional Budget
Office. One of the findings in this report is that the NEA's spending
priorities are heavily skewed towards elderly Americans, despite NEA's claim
that it is an educational organization with a primary focus on schools and
children. The study finds that "for each dollar in new spending on children
and education that the NEA proposes (over $24 billion annually), it
advocates $5.24 in new spending on Social Security". The report also claims
"that the taxes to fund the NEA agenda are probably politically impractical.
According to the report, the NEA would need over thirteen times as much in
taxes as was raised by the 1993 budget package". Berthoud points out, "no
organization that advocates this massive expansion of federal spending and
probably massive increase in deficits can claim to be helping children. This
agenda will break the financial back of America's future generations."

If that isn't shocking enough for you, let's examine the U.S. Budget and see
how the government actually spent its money on areas affecting children,
families, and the elderly. The source for this data is the U.S. Budget FY
1998, Historical Tables, OMB Feb. 1997, and The Economic and Budget Outlook
FY 1998-2007, CBO, Jan. 1997)

In the postwar era entitlements have grown rapidly. Nearly all of this
growth has been due to age-based retirement and health-care programs, not
programs targeted to children, youth, families, the unskilled, the
unemployed, or poor.

Entitlements are cash or in-kind payments to (or on behalf of) individuals
that are not contractually linked to payments or services received by the
government in return. The federal government distributes most entitlement
benefits directly, but some are disbursed through grants to state and local
authorities. The entitlements outlay category includes only benefit
payments; it excludes the cost of program administration.

Federal entitlement spending

$35.4 billion
1996 $914.4 billion

1996 FY Federal spending

Entitlements $914.4 billion 58.6%

Defense $265.7 billion 17.0%

Interest $241.1 billion 15.5%

All Other $139.1 billion 8.9%

------------------

1560.3 billion

Over the postwar era, entitlements have been the fastest-growing category of
federal spending, rising from under half to more than triple the size of
defense, and far outstripping the growth of the economy.

Actual Federal entitlement spending

FY 1965 $35.9 billion

FY 1996 $914.4 billion

Retirement and health-care programs that primarily benefit older Americans
account for virtually all the expansion, and today comprise four-fifths of
all federal entitlement spending.

FY 1996 Federal entitlement spending

Food and housing $62.3 billion 6.8%

Cash welfare $62.7 billion 6.9%

Other non-retirement $60.2 billion 6.6%

Health benefits $308.0 billion 33.7%

Federal pensions $74.4 billion 8.1%

Social security $346.8 billion 37.9%

-----------------

$914.4 billion





The lion's share of federal entitlement dollars is paid out without regard
to financial need.

FY 1996 Federal entitlement spending

Means tested $218.2 billion 23.9%

Partially means tested $36.1 billion 4.0%

Non-means tested $660.1 billion 72.2%

---------

$914.4 billion

Means-tested entitlements are those for which recipients must demonstrate
some degree of financial need. They include AFDC, SSI, the EITC, Food
Stamps, and Medicaid. Non-means-tested entitlements do not consider
financial need in determining eligibility; instead, eligibility is based on
categorical requirements, such as age, disability, or prior employment.
Non-means-tested entitlements include Social Security, Medicare, federal
civilian and military retirement, Unemployment Insurance, and farm price
supports. Partly means-tested entitlements (mainly veterans' health care and
student loans) sometimes consider financial need in determining eligibility,
but according to rules that do not apply to all benefits granted.

Of all government benefit dollars, less than one out of seven serves to
raise Americans out of poverty. Indeed, federal entitlements are as likely
to benefit the affluent as the needy.

Although only one in eight Americans is aged sixty-five or older, the
elderly receive three-fifths of all federal entitlements.

Federal entitlements by age group FY 1996

Ages under 18 $88.5 billion 9.7%

Ages 18-64 $234.1 billion 25.4%

Ages 65 and older $557.0 billion 60.9%

Ages unknown $34.9 billion 3.8%

-----------------

$914.4 billion

Federal benefits to the elderly have grown dramatically in recent decades
and, in per capita dollars, now dwarf benefits going to other age groups.

Per capita entitlements by age group FY 1996

Ages under 18 $1,282.00

Ages 18-64 $1,442.00

Ages 65 and older $16,451.00

Even including nonentitlement outlays, per capita federal spending on the
elderly towers 9 to 1 over per capita spending on children.

The United states has gained a troubling distinction among developed
nations: In no other country do government benefits so favor the old.

Now you're probably thinking, "But they need it right?" Sort of the same
myth as poor old grannie being denied visitation and the cookies getting
cold.

Let's look..

The myth about widespread senior poverty to the contrary, the elderly rank
about average in comparison to all households in per capita cash income.

Per capita before-tax cash income by household type in FY 1996.

All households $18,250

Elderly households $17,197

Households with children $13,692

Single mother households $ 7,385

Households w/o children $24,584

Please note the elderly is 25.6% greater than households with children.

1996 Federal tax liability for a working couple and an elderly couple with
$30,000 income

Working couple $6,938

Elderly couple $690

Beyond income, the elderly have advantages in financial assets, where they
do better than any younger age group.

Average household financial net worth by age group in 1993

Under age 35 $7,950

Ages 35-44 $35,081

Ages 45-54 $35,073

Ages 55-64 $56,727

Ages 65 & older $61,946

Average household total net worth by age group in 1993

Under age 35 $30,144

Ages 35-44 $93,598

Ages 45-54 $125,856

Ages 55-64 $169,491

Ages 65 & older $151,681


The elderly also enjoy high rates of homeownership, which are declining for
the young but still rising for seniors.

Homeownership rates by age group 1995

Under age 25 14.20%

Ages 25-34 44.80%

Ages 34-44 65.20%

Ages 45-64 77.25%

Ages 65 and older 77.80%

As for health care, the share of Americans without insurance declines
dramatically with age.

Percentage of persons without health insurance in 1995 as a percentage of
all persons in their age group.

Under age 18 14.8%

Ages 18-24 28.9%

Ages 25-34 22.3%

Ages 35-44 16.3%

Ages 45-54 13.7%

Ages 55-64 13.8%

Ages 65 and older 1.1%

This information is from a study done by NEIL HOWE AND RICHARD JACKSON for
the National Taxpayers Union.

These statistics clearly show that lobbying efforts by senior citizen
organizations have been quite successful in "providing" for entitlements for
the elderly, with the lion's share not being means tested. They also show
that many elderly people should be means tested for they not only receive
the lion's share of the entitlements by are also the best off financially.
The most alarming statistics show how much is allocated to seniors that
least need it, and how little is allocated to children, families, and the
poor, that most need it.

My challenge to all grandparents and parents that are "truly" concerned
about the best interests of children is to call your congressmen and demand
means testing for entitlements. Demand that the entitlements are taken away
from those that do not need them and reallocated to those that do, mainly
the children and the poor. This could be don without even raising taxes and
we could do something for our children.

Here's your chance to put your money where your mouth is. Our children are
counting on you.

What to love about the United States.
 

Rush said in 1999:

National Review (NR Wire)

October 6, 1999

LIMBAUGH: BUSH "NO CONSERVATIVE"

Conservative talkmeister Rush Limbaugh blasted away at George W. Bush with
both barrels today, stoking a possible clash between grass-roots
conservatives and the front-running candidate who is already pursuing a
centerist general election strategy.

"He's really wandered off the reservation here lately folks," Limbaugh
intoned, before making the case against the recent Bush positioning.

"In my mind," he told his listeners, "no conservative running for president
would make the kind of statements that he's made. No conservative running
for president would leave his philosophical brothers and sisters dying on
the congressional battlefield the way Bush did with that EITC (Earned Income
Tax Credit) thing. And now he's done it again with the speech at the
Manhattan Institute. He's done it twice in seven or eight days time."

"This obviously is a carefully crafted strategy." Limbaugh continued. "What
it means is that solid conservatives from Tom DeLay to Dick Armey, who are
doing all they can to eke out small majorities and beat back Clinton and all
his Big Government schemes-issue after issue-end up being emasculated by
Bush's comments."

"Who wants a Republican moderate as president?" Limbaugh asked, a question
the Bush camp must hope that other conservatives don't begin asking.

What to love about the United States.
 

National Review Online:



July 14, 2003, Issue



Spending with the Best of 'Em
By Kevin A. Hassett

Under the current Bush budget, federal spending will have increased by 19.6
percent over the first three years of the administration. Since government
spending is growing much faster than the economy as a whole, the share of
our national income devoted to Leviathan has increased markedly, from 18.4
percent to 19.9 percent. Cato Institute economist Veronique de Rugy notes
that this dramatic surge is virtually unprecedented in the history of
government spending in the U.S. According to de Rugy's research, three of
the five biggest increases in government spending in history have all
occurred during the first three years of the Bush administration; the other
two occurred during the Second World War. That sounds pretty bad, but even
these numbers undoubtedly understate the problem, since they do not account
for the huge prescription-drug benefit President Bush is working hard to
push through Congress.

"Horvath" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 06 Jul 2003 15:18:04 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

What you have described here is America of the past.

Let's take a look at the futu

The law of the land, the US Constitution is becoming less and less
relevant.

Spending under the Bush administrations first three years has gone up
13.5%.
The same time duration under Clinton only yielded an increase of 3.3%.

Bull****.

[all other bull**** deleted]




Ave Imperator Bush!
Bush Was Right! Four More Beers!

What to love about the United States.
 

http://www.cbo.gov/showdoc.cfm?index=3650&sequence=0

What to love about the United States.
 

hehehe, a piano in the bathroom brings a certain ambiguity to the phrase,
"working on a movement"
Scout

"Flying Tadpole" wrote in message
...


Scout wrote:

A fluffy cover would make
a nifty stool softener.

His forte is clearly puns delivered piano.

What to love about the United States.
 

Responding to being labeled a whining gloom and doomer
is not facilitated by more of the same. You only make your
own life miserable by continued futile efforts at pretending
you can make a difference by posting material that is else-
where available to all who are concerned about such things.

Put your own house in order. The house of the country and
world will stand or fall no matter what you do. You may
as well stop beating yourself about the head and shoulders
and go wilderness hiking if that is what you enjoy.

Accept the fact that the enlightened philosophy will not stand
as long as there so many unenlightened. The time is not right
for it. One must accept the cycles that occur in the natural
order of time. Resistance is futile. You live in the wrong time
for your endowments. They will not be appreciated in your
lifetime.

There is only one justification for what you do. Either you
enjoy your gloom and doom or you don't. If you enjoy it
then accept that you do and post your material with the
understanding that it gives you pleasure to do so. Make
this clear to the reader.

Whether it is by design or by omission your posts appear
to be the rantings of a very discontented man. For your own
sake, if indeed you are discontented, choose a more pleasant
path for yourself. Choose a path that gives you pleasure and
fulfillment. Preaching to a choir of the willingly dependent
will only serve to defeat you at every turn. Such as these
don't want your help nor do they deserve it.

Make no mistake, I only preach to the choir because the
ideas and the presentation of the ideas gives me pleasure.
I harbor no false hopes of ever changing the world. It
does not heed my advice. I endeavor to enjoy as much
as I am able those things the world provides that make
life worth living. I have no time to waste trying to convert
those who have no desire to be converted.

If it ever gets to the point where gloom and doom is my
constant state of mind then I will at least have the guts to
put a gun to my head and rid the world of another unneeded
impediment. There would be too much hypocrisy to otherwise
bear.


"Gilligan" wrote in message thlink.net...
It's obvious which generation is the most important:


Government Budget Spending

Families have long been recognized as the basic foundation of every society.
Children have long been recognized our hope for the future. There is little
doubt that in today's society, families and our children are under extreme
pressure from many sources. Politicians coined the term "family values," but
most elected officials have ignored children's issues when they get to
Congress. Our federal government has failed miserably in promoting and
funding programs and ideals that strengthen the family. Just look at our
government's failed "War on Drugs, the Tax Code, our declining Educational
System, or the many liberal laws that have given us such things as abortion,
no-fault divorce, a ban on prayer in schools, widespread pornography,
violence on TV, state intrusion into family autonomy, etc. and the reasons
for this pressure becomes obvious.

For those GPs on that advocate GP "forced visitation" laws and use as their
argument their concern for the "best interests and welfare of the children",
here's your chance to help, your chance to put you money where your mouth
is.

A study of federal spending, using the U.S. Federal Budget reveals some
interesting facts. One glaring inequity that stands out is the fact that
while the government often gives lip service to their concern for our
children, they fail miserably when it comes to providing the funding and
programs necessary to help. As we all know, the Federal Government is quick
to tax and spend, but it is how the money is spent that is quite revealing.
The federal government currently spends more than five times more on
programs and entitlements for Americans over 65 than it spends on children,
even though there are twice as many children as elderly. If this isn't
shocking enough, how about this. The lion's share of this money spent on the
elderly is not even means tested. This means the money is just doled out
without verifying whether it is needed.

What's even more shocking is that organizations that purport to support our
children, are in fact partners in this injustice. Let's just look at one
such organization's (the NEA) legislative program agenda. In a study, John
Berthoud, Vice President of the Alexis de Toqueville Institution, revealed
that "If every item in the National Education Association's (NEA)
Legislative Program for the 104th Congress were enacted, federal spending
would increase by at least $702 billion annually." The study uses data on
legislative proposals compiled by the National Taxpayers Union Foundation in
their BillTally tracking system. The spending estimates for the different
proposals come from non-partisan sources such as the Congressional Budget
Office. One of the findings in this report is that the NEA's spending
priorities are heavily skewed towards elderly Americans, despite NEA's claim
that it is an educational organization with a primary focus on schools and
children. The study finds that "for each dollar in new spending on children
and education that the NEA proposes (over $24 billion annually), it
advocates $5.24 in new spending on Social Security". The report also claims
"that the taxes to fund the NEA agenda are probably politically impractical.
According to the report, the NEA would need over thirteen times as much in
taxes as was raised by the 1993 budget package". Berthoud points out, "no
organization that advocates this massive expansion of federal spending and
probably massive increase in deficits can claim to be helping children. This
agenda will break the financial back of America's future generations."

If that isn't shocking enough for you, let's examine the U.S. Budget and see
how the government actually spent its money on areas affecting children,
families, and the elderly. The source for this data is the U.S. Budget FY
1998, Historical Tables, OMB Feb. 1997, and The Economic and Budget Outlook
FY 1998-2007, CBO, Jan. 1997)

In the postwar era entitlements have grown rapidly. Nearly all of this
growth has been due to age-based retirement and health-care programs, not
programs targeted to children, youth, families, the unskilled, the
unemployed, or poor.

Entitlements are cash or in-kind payments to (or on behalf of) individuals
that are not contractually linked to payments or services received by the
government in return. The federal government distributes most entitlement
benefits directly, but some are disbursed through grants to state and local
authorities. The entitlements outlay category includes only benefit
payments; it excludes the cost of program administration.

Federal entitlement spending

$35.4 billion
1996 $914.4 billion

1996 FY Federal spending

Entitlements $914.4 billion 58.6%

Defense $265.7 billion 17.0%

Interest $241.1 billion 15.5%

All Other $139.1 billion 8.9%

------------------

1560.3 billion

Over the postwar era, entitlements have been the fastest-growing category of
federal spending, rising from under half to more than triple the size of
defense, and far outstripping the growth of the economy.

Actual Federal entitlement spending

FY 1965 $35.9 billion

FY 1996 $914.4 billion

Retirement and health-care programs that primarily benefit older Americans
account for virtually all the expansion, and today comprise four-fifths of
all federal entitlement spending.

FY 1996 Federal entitlement spending

Food and housing $62.3 billion 6.8%

Cash welfare $62.7 billion 6.9%

Other non-retirement $60.2 billion 6.6%

Health benefits $308.0 billion 33.7%

Federal pensions $74.4 billion 8.1%

Social security $346.8 billion 37.9%

-----------------

$914.4 billion





The lion's share of federal entitlement dollars is paid out without regard
to financial need.

FY 1996 Federal entitlement spending

Means tested $218.2 billion 23.9%

Partially means tested $36.1 billion 4.0%

Non-means tested $660.1 billion 72.2%

---------

$914.4 billion

Means-tested entitlements are those for which recipients must demonstrate
some degree of financial need. They include AFDC, SSI, the EITC, Food
Stamps, and Medicaid. Non-means-tested entitlements do not consider
financial need in determining eligibility; instead, eligibility is based on
categorical requirements, such as age, disability, or prior employment.
Non-means-tested entitlements include Social Security, Medicare, federal
civilian and military retirement, Unemployment Insurance, and farm price
supports. Partly means-tested entitlements (mainly veterans' health care and
student loans) sometimes consider financial need in determining eligibility,
but according to rules that do not apply to all benefits granted.

Of all government benefit dollars, less than one out of seven serves to
raise Americans out of poverty. Indeed, federal entitlements are as likely
to benefit the affluent as the needy.

Although only one in eight Americans is aged sixty-five or older, the
elderly receive three-fifths of all federal entitlements.

Federal entitlements by age group FY 1996

Ages under 18 $88.5 billion 9.7%

Ages 18-64 $234.1 billion 25.4%

Ages 65 and older $557.0 billion 60.9%

Ages unknown $34.9 billion 3.8%

-----------------

$914.4 billion

Federal benefits to the elderly have grown dramatically in recent decades
and, in per capita dollars, now dwarf benefits going to other age groups.

Per capita entitlements by age group FY 1996

Ages under 18 $1,282.00

Ages 18-64 $1,442.00

Ages 65 and older $16,451.00

Even including nonentitlement outlays, per capita federal spending on the
elderly towers 9 to 1 over per capita spending on children.

The United states has gained a troubling distinction among developed
nations: In no other country do government benefits so favor the old.

Now you're probably thinking, "But they need it right?" Sort of the same
myth as poor old grannie being denied visitation and the cookies getting
cold.

Let's look..

The myth about widespread senior poverty to the contrary, the elderly rank
about average in comparison to all households in per capita cash income.

Per capita before-tax cash income by household type in FY 1996.

All households $18,250

Elderly households $17,197

Households with children $13,692

Single mother households $ 7,385

Households w/o children $24,584

Please note the elderly is 25.6% greater than households with children.

1996 Federal tax liability for a working couple and an elderly couple with
$30,000 income

Working couple $6,938

Elderly couple $690

Beyond income, the elderly have advantages in financial assets, where they
do better than any younger age group.

Average household financial net worth by age group in 1993

Under age 35 $7,950

Ages 35-44 $35,081

Ages 45-54 $35,073

Ages 55-64 $56,727

Ages 65 & older $61,946

Average household total net worth by age group in 1993

Under age 35 $30,144

Ages 35-44 $93,598

Ages 45-54 $125,856

Ages 55-64 $169,491

Ages 65 & older $151,681


The elderly also enjoy high rates of homeownership, which are declining for
the young but still rising for seniors.

Homeownership rates by age group 1995

Under age 25 14.20%

Ages 25-34 44.80%

Ages 34-44 65.20%

Ages 45-64 77.25%

Ages 65 and older 77.80%

As for health care, the share of Americans without insurance declines
dramatically with age.

Percentage of persons without health insurance in 1995 as a percentage of
all persons in their age group.

Under age 18 14.8%

Ages 18-24 28.9%

Ages 25-34 22.3%

Ages 35-44 16.3%

Ages 45-54 13.7%

Ages 55-64 13.8%

Ages 65 and older 1.1%

This information is from a study done by NEIL HOWE AND RICHARD JACKSON for
the National Taxpayers Union.

These statistics clearly show that lobbying efforts by senior citizen
organizations have been quite successful in "providing" for entitlements for
the elderly, with the lion's share not being means tested. They also show
that many elderly people should be means tested for they not only receive
the lion's share of the entitlements by are also the best off financially.
The most alarming statistics show how much is allocated to seniors that
least need it, and how little is allocated to children, families, and the
poor, that most need it.

My challenge to all grandparents and parents that are "truly" concerned
about the best interests of children is to call your congressmen and demand
means testing for entitlements. Demand that the entitlements are taken away
from those that do not need them and reallocated to those that do, mainly
the children and the poor. This could be don without even raising taxes and
we could do something for our children.

Here's your chance to put your money where your mouth is. Our children are
counting on you.

What to love about the United States.
 

hehehe, a piano in the bathroom brings a certain ambiguity to the phrase,
"working on a movement"
Scout

Don't give Timmy ideas...he's bad enough all on his own....
--
katysails
s/v Chanteuse
Kirie Elite 32
Ad eundum quo nemo ante iit.
http://katysails.tripod.com

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax
and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein

What to love about the United States.
 

Scout wrote:

hehehe, a piano in the bathroom brings a certain ambiguity to the phrase,
"working on a movement"
Scout


I trust you are familiar with the .asa cedar bucket signature
songs. Inspired by Capt Neal's finest hour. ANd now driven by the
DTs, I'll put a sung version of the first up on mp3 in the near
future, but it will take them some time to check the lyrics out.

http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/asapo.htm#Catfish
http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/asapo.htm#Scatfish


Flying Tadpole

What to love about the United States.
 

Yeah, but you're a freak of nature.

"Horvath" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 6 Jul 2003 16:28:26 -0400, "katysails"
wrote this crap:


and where plumbers take their families on
vacation to Europe.

Our plumber lives in a 250K house and has a cottage on the lake and still
takes extravagant vacations. Our electrician has an
even more expensive house, a second house on the lake and a 30 foot motor
boat.


I pity those people who have such small houses and small boats.




Ave Imperator Bush!
Bush Was Right! Four More Beers!

What to love about the United States.
 

On Sun, 06 Jul 2003 21:42:05 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

2003 Budget Completes Big Jump in Spending


By Glenn Kessler
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, April 15, 2002; Page A01

That was over a year ago, dumbass.




Ave Imperator Bush!
Bush Was Right! Four More Beers!

What to love about the United States.
 

Taddy,
It just keeps getting better and better! I can only hope you are sharing
your wonderful talents outside of asa!
Scout


"Flying Tadpole" wrote
I trust you are familiar with the .asa cedar bucket signature
songs. Inspired by Capt Neal's finest hour. ANd now driven by the
DTs, I'll put a sung version of the first up on mp3 in the near
future, but it will take them some time to check the lyrics out.

http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/asapo.htm#Catfish
http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/asapo.htm#Scatfish


Flying Tadpole

What to love about the United States.
 

er...you mean there's something outside of asa?

FT

Scout wrote:

Taddy,
It just keeps getting better and better! I can only hope you are sharing
your wonderful talents outside of asa!
Scout

"Flying Tadpole" wrote
I trust you are familiar with the .asa cedar bucket signature
songs. Inspired by Capt Neal's finest hour. ANd now driven by the
DTs, I'll put a sung version of the first up on mp3 in the near
future, but it will take them some time to check the lyrics out.

http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/asapo.htm#Catfish
http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/asapo.htm#Scatfish


Flying Tadpole

What to love about the United States.
 

Well, _my_ cedar bucket is best quality stainless steel, so
there.

FT

Scout wrote:

Lord Yes! Word is (you didn't here this from me) that in other ports, cedar
buckets are considered antediluvian - sailors everywhere are stroking their
beards and clucking about pvc! Mind you, old ways should never be tampered
with! Still, progress will have its way.
Scout
p.s. - see you (all) later, I'm heading out for a 2 day sail.

"Flying Tadpole" wrote in message
...
er...you mean there's something outside of asa?

What to love about the United States.
 

Very economical - doubles as a stewing pot?
Scout

"Flying Tadpole" wrote in message
...
Well, _my_ cedar bucket is best quality stainless steel, so there.

What to love about the United States.
 

Don't be stewpid.


"Scout" wrote in message ...
Very economical - doubles as a stewing pot?
Scout

"Flying Tadpole" wrote in message
...
Well, _my_ cedar bucket is best quality stainless steel, so there.

What to love about the United States.
 

hehehe, ok that does it - now I'm really outta here. see you in a couple of
days.
Scout


"jlrogers" wrote in message
gy.com...
Don't be stewpid.


"Scout" wrote in message
...
Very economical - doubles as a stewing pot?
Scout

"Flying Tadpole" wrote in message
...
Well, _my_ cedar bucket is best quality stainless steel, so there.

What to love about the United States.
 

Check the date on the Hustler magazine you get in the mail. It's a month or
two in advance, same with many magazines. That date refers to the issue
date, not the current date.

What's even more telling are the responses by various "Conservatives" to the
factual articles I post. Apparently "Conservatives" must resort to personal
attacks and blind allegiance to a party or man rather than principle when
questioned or confronted with evidence that their actions deviate from their
"principles".





"Horvath" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 06 Jul 2003 23:26:53 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

National Review Online:



July 14, 2003, Issue

Today is only July 7,2003, dumbass.




Ave Imperator Bush!
Bush Was Right! Four More Beers!

What to love about the United States.
 

Oz1 wrote:

On Mon, 07 Jul 2003 21:56:48 +0930, Flying Tadpole
wrote:

Well, _my_ cedar bucket is best quality stainless steel, so
there.

FT


Doesn't it chip the paintwork?

Oz1...of the 3 twins.
I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.

Only when it spills.

FT